05/22/2008
John McCain and Ellen DeGeneres Talk Same-Sex Marriage
John McCain taped Ellen DeGeneres' show yesterday (it airs today) and the subject of same-sex marriage came up. Ellen is firing on all pistons here. She takes what was becoming an awkward impasse and drives home her argument with a laugh.
I've transcribed the conversation:
MCCAIN: I just believe in the unique status of marriage between man and woman. And I know that we have a respectful disagreement on that issue.
ELLEN: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I think that it is looked at and some people are saying the same that blacks and women did not have the right to vote. Women just got the right to vote in 1920. Blacks didn't have the right to vote till 1870. It just feels like there's this old way of thinking (that) we are not all the same. We are all the same people. All of us. You're no different than I am. Our love is the same. (applause) To me what it feels like just, you know, I will speak for myself...it feels when someone says you can have a contract and you'll still have insurance and you'll get all that. It sounds to me like saying well you can sit there (points in one direction), you just can't sit there (points in another direction). That's what it sounds like to me. It doesn't feel inclusive. It feels isolated. It feels like we aren't owed the same things and the same wording.
MCCAIN: Well, I've heard you articulate that position in a very eloquent fashion. We just have a disagreement and I, along with many, many others wish you every happiness.
ELLEN: Thank you. So you'll walk me down the aisle? Is that what you said?
(laughter)
MCCAIN: Touché
Watch it, AFTER THE JUMP...
Posted 7:56 AM EST by Andy Towle in California, Election 2008, Ellen DeGeneres, Gay Marriage, John McCain, News | Permalink
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This defender of aparthied must be defeated!!!
Posted by: Joseph | May 22, 2008 8:14:04 AM
The fact he was unable to counteract Ellen's argument on why he defends traditional marriage shows how much of a lame duck John McCain is and why Barack Obama will run circles around this guy during the debates. If only the rest of America could recognize this *sigh*
Posted by: Alex | May 22, 2008 8:36:23 AM
Oh God - we are going to have a choice between and empty suit and a Nazi.
Posted by: Shane | May 22, 2008 8:48:25 AM
Shame Ellen was too nice and didn't bring up the fact that while he was Married to HIS 1st wife...he cheated on her with his 2nd wife....then she shoulda' mentioned the ol' "Sanctity of Marriage" BS!...
Posted by: Disgusted American | May 22, 2008 8:59:46 AM
I don't think Ellen was too nice. I think she played it just right. She made her point, nicely, made it well, and let his lack of meaningful response speak for itself. He had no argument to make, because there is none, and it made him look bad, without anyone being able to label her strident or in your face. (There are people who can and should be that, but not Ellen.) And it's a reminder to the gay voters who still need reminding: he is not our candidate.
Posted by: Ernie | May 22, 2008 9:28:53 AM
What a loser! He knows what's right and wrong, can't stand him!
Posted by: Bill | May 22, 2008 9:35:35 AM
Um, do you people realize that Barack Obama (and for that matter Hillary Clinton) agree with McCain on the issue of marriage and rather than marriage, only support civil unions. Civil unions are exactly what Ellen was arguing against. I'm not defending McCain, but let's not pretend that he is any worse on the issue than the two Democrats running.
And he didn't refer to the "sanctity" of marriage, which I frankly appreciate as coming from him it would be ridiculous. He can have his opinion that marriage is one man + one woman, whatever, but don't give me that ridiculous argument about how it's so ultra super important that it has to be "protected." He's for equal protection under the law, just under a different name. He opposed the Federal Marriage Amendment and felt, like Clinton and Obama, that it was up to the states to decide.
He is NOT George Bush on this issue.
God I cannot believe I'm defending John McCain but I've already watched the destruction of the Clinton legacy with lies and bullshit and it just gets old. Call a duck a duck. They are all against equal marriage and he is no worse than Saint Obama.
Posted by: Banne | May 22, 2008 9:43:33 AM
The 3 positions are hardly the same.
Has McCain ever really come out in favor of civil unions?
What he said after the CA decision was that he supports the rights of states to define marriage however they want -- specifically the right of California to define marriage as between a man and a woman. That makes him more anti-gay than even Schwarzenegger.
Obama and Clinton are at least clearly for civil unions.
Posted by: Kevinvt | May 22, 2008 9:51:56 AM
John, you ignorant slut.
Posted by: Jake | May 22, 2008 9:54:37 AM
Banne, you have "already watched the destruction of the Clinton legacy with lies and bullshit"??? I hope you're referring to the lies and bullshit that Hillary and Bill have campaigned on.
The good news is that no matter if McCain or Obama wins in November, they are both against a constitutional amendment prohibiting same sex marriage. But for those who think the choice doesn't make a difference on this topic, just keep in mind that McCain has already stated numerous times that he would appointment conservative judges to the Supreme Court. That will make all of the difference in the world.
Posted by: Rob | May 22, 2008 10:02:36 AM
Ellen is really blooming lately. I really don't think, in fact I know I couldn't, sit down next to McCain and give him a piece of my mind. Ellen did it and drove her point home. We cannot let McCain and all that think like him tell us what to do anymore. Still… Does anyone else here feel like pelting him with water balloons and eggs each time he speaks?
Posted by: Alec Sarkas | May 22, 2008 10:30:41 AM
Is it not enough to have civil unions that offer the same benefits of married couples? The concern is that once given the title of marriage, gays will go further and begin (as example) a push for all grade school and high school text books to obliterate marriage as it is known and has been known for centuries.
The advocacy of man-woman marriage alone will be regarded morally as hate speech, and shortly thereafer it will be deemed so in law. The terms male and female, man and woman will gradually lose their significance. Sexes will become interchangeable and it will be said whatever a father can do a second mother can do and so on.
Young women will be encouraged to marry their prince or princess.
We will have entered something beyond Huxley's Brave New World. All thanks to the hubris (in one case) of four individuals on the California court.
Posted by: Being Counted | May 22, 2008 10:48:34 AM
I'm really curious what prompted McCain to actually go on Ellen's show? I'm somewhat impressed that he did. Obviously, he knew going into it that the subject was going to be brought up and that it was safe to assume her entire audience would agree with her.
The idea of having to "settle" for a civil union disgusts me. But I will say I'd rather settle for that right now, and then show the world why it's only a step in the right direction and not the end goal. (Rather than pushing so hard for completely equal and continually not get it) I think a lot of the people who are against it would change their minds after they see it in action.
Posted by: lis | May 22, 2008 11:15:34 AM
@ Being Counted:
Apart from your final paragraph, I have no trouble with your predictions.
This may come as a surprise to you, but most of us in this forum would actually welcome a more enlightened society.
Posted by: Mark | May 22, 2008 11:20:58 AM
Did anyone notice that McCain couldn't even look at Ellen in the eye when giving his answer?
Posted by: RR | May 22, 2008 11:53:54 AM
He couldn't even sell that shit with a straight face. Did you see how sheepish he was? I don't think he even believes what he's saying. That makes him worse than someone who's just dumb.
Posted by: Michael | May 22, 2008 12:30:57 PM
PS @BEING COUNTED
Ahhh, the slippery slope argument. Last refuge of someone who's on shaky ground.
Posted by: Michael | May 22, 2008 12:32:20 PM
@BEING COUNTED: People who are for "traidional" marriage and scared about the "re-definition" of marriage forget that in the 80s it was deemed possible for a man to rape his wife. This was a radical re-definition of marriage. The "traditional marrriage" view was that a man OWNED his wife, to bear his children, so she had to take it whenever he shoved it in. The idea that the law changed the definition of marriage, so they were equal partners, is exactly the change in marriage that modernized it to even think about gay marriage. So when a woman asks for traditional marriage, I say " which tradition honey, the beatings or the rapes?"
There is not a single non-hypocritical argument that can be made against gay marriage rights. PERIOD.
And the fact that there is not a single candidate in either party willing to stand up for equality makes your country the most pathetic, backwards moving country in the first world.
Posted by: Strepsi | May 22, 2008 1:33:17 PM
why is anyone surprised by what he said? She got her point across, he wasn't going to change his opinion on it, plus the man is 71 years old...he is not likely to understand gay people or their issues. The way that gay people will get equal rights is based on the next generations views.
Posted by: Paul | May 22, 2008 2:07:39 PM
Banne says:
"Um, do you people realize that Barack Obama (and for that matter Hillary Clinton) agree with McCain on the issue of marriage and rather than marriage, only support civil unions. Civil unions are exactly what Ellen was arguing against. I'm not defending McCain, but let's not pretend that he is any worse on the issue than the two Democrats running."
This is incorrect. McCain is worse. True, Obama and Hillary do not support same-sex marriage (and deserve criticism for it, even if their lack of support has political logic). But they, on the record, support CUs and have spoken out clearly in favor of them. McCain, on the other hand, is, at best, vague on CUs. He supports the right of gay people to "enter into contracts" but in response to NH's passage of CU legislation in 2007, he said, "'I am opposed to that legislation.'" Furthermore, McCain backed AZ's ballot initiative to ban gay marriage (which lost) and, unlike CA's Republican governor, would back it in CA. He would likely appoint much more conservative Supreme Court justices than Obama (or Hillary). So to claim that he's no worse on the issue than they are is simply bullshit.
Posted by: Ernie | May 22, 2008 2:12:10 PM
Wow! The election isn't over yet? It's been over 5 months already!
Posted by: duffy | May 22, 2008 2:20:55 PM
As long as the Democrats control congress, the FMA will not pass. This will not stop the states, however. Even California.
Let's face it, either you have the political power to gain marriage rights or you don't. Look what happened to the Mormons.
Posted by: anon | May 22, 2008 2:31:26 PM
I support MIKE GRAVEL precisly because he is for gay marriage and for separtation of church and state. He his older and has experience. Why do we ignore this man?
Posted by: MeMees | May 22, 2008 3:54:39 PM
Neither Obama nor Clinton would ever back amendments to ban gay marriage at the state or federal level. McCain backed that AZ ban and thankfully a state finally said no. Hopefully CA will also say no to the ban ammendment.
McCain would certainly appoint regressive (conservative) judges to the supreme court. With the current make up of the court it will be decades before that tilt can be corrected.
Posted by: birdman | May 22, 2008 3:55:25 PM
I'm thrilled Ellen went to bat on this issue, but I don't understand why she seems to be the only person willing to ask McCain ... you know ... QUESTIONS. It's as if he got the nomination and the media decided to put him in their back pocket and forget about him.
I say they move her from syndicated daytime talk to CNN, since she seems to be the only person with the stones to talk about the issues with the ol' man.
Posted by: Kate | May 22, 2008 4:25:10 PM