Dharun Ravi’s Support From The Gay Community

Ap_dharun_ravi_jef_120315_wg

Reuters published an article yesterday neatly summarizing the support Dharun Ravi has received from various members of the gay community. (If you're just tuning in: Ravi is the 20-year-old who, two years ago, briefly used his webcam to spy on his new roommate, Tyler Clementi, during a gay hookup; Clementi committed suicide shortly thereafter, and Ravi's now been convicted of a hate crime. He could face substantial prison time, and will likely be deported.)

Reuters quoted Aaron Hicklin, the debonaire editor of Out:

"Ravi's conviction was a compelling signal that harassment and bullying of LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender) people carries penalties," Aaron Hicklin [wrote] in an article arguing that Ravi be set free.

"Yet the verdict also left a bitter aftertaste, as if what was being satisfied was not justice, but revenge."

Hicklin cited a past comment by Middlesex County Prosecutor Bruce Kaplan that even if Clementi were alive today, he would have presented virtually the same case to the jury. Anyone who believes Kaplan, Hicklin wrote, is "kidding himself."

"Ravi was convicted because Clementi is dead," Hicklin wrote, adding that the suicide "left us reaching for simplistic answers where there are none."

… and gay rights activist Bill Dobbs:

At a rally in support of Ravi outside the New Jersey Statehouse in Trenton this week, Bill Dobbs … told the crowd that Ravi was "overcharged" in the incident.

"The hate crime law in New Jersey has got so many problems that it should be repealed," Dobbs said. "It has become a dangerous weapon that is not necessary."

… and Andrew Sullivan:

Sullivan … said the hate crime charges, without which Ravi would likely get probation and no prison time, were "tenuous" and "repellent."

"This was a bigoted online hazing, followed by a judicial witch-hunt," Sullivan wrote.

… and lesbian writer E.J. Graff:

E.J. Graff … said in her column in The American Prospect, "I fear that Ravi is an easy scapegoat for a complicated problem."

… and the head of Garden State Equality, Steven Goldstein:

"Justice is best served by his serving some jail time for the crime committed," … Goldstein said. "The moderate position is not to throw the book at this young man, nor should he get off Scott free."

… and mentions that Ravi has the support of Dan Savage and New Jersey's gay ex-governor, Jim McGreevey, as well.

 

Comments

  1. Virilene. says

    Every single one of those comments not only misses the point, but is wrong.

    The number and variety of charges were brought against Ravi so that the prosecution would have leverage, so that they could make a case, and so that they could obtain a conviction. This is what prosecutors do.

    Ravi had a chance to plea bargain on very favorable terms, but he refused. Gross miscalculation on his part (not to mention his “attorney”.)

    To this day, Ravi has never acknowledged wrongdoing or culpability on his part. Until he does, a severe punishment has to stand as society’s affirmation that a wrong was committed, and yes…with deadly effect and consequences.

    I think he should see some incarceration, not a long incarceration, perhaps, but some. Minimum of six months, nor more than a year. If he acknowledges the wrongs he committed, then probation. If not, deportation.

    The LGBT community can’t get in an uproar when wrongs against us go unpunished, and ALSO get in an uproar when wrongs get punished severely. The severity in this case lies in the fact that Ravi has neither shown remorse nor acknowledged doing wrong. The LGBT community AND the greater society demand that he do so.

  2. says

    the columbine and virginia tech massacres were followed by witch-hunts against “goths”, marilyn manson music, videogames and movies.

    not gun-culture, and not gun-control laws, not the NRA.

    ravi was guilty of certain specific invasions of privacy and indeed seemed to be bullying, with “gay” being his target…

    ..but what’s the moral? don’t bully gay classmates, wait until you’ve grown up and then go into politics and bully every lgbt person in the country with your bigotry, prejudice and incitement of both?

    in essence, cyber-element removed, ravi would be punished for the very things that win GOP politicians votes.

    focusing on ravi and not the grown adult “leaders” of america who fan the flames of bigotry and contribute to a culture of anti-gay prejudice is a distraction from reality.

    it’s like focusing on the westboro baptists church when the RCC, LDS , American Evangelicals and Southern Baptists have much-more dangerous and far-reaching bigotry being promoted.

  3. Steve says

    There are protestors that say the sentence is too harsh. If Ravi filmed and posted video of one of the protestors’ 18 year old daughters getting banged by a guy, and she killed herself; the protestors would probably want Ravi’s head on a stick. It just seems like protestors to Ravi’s sentence view his offense and poor judgement as not being a harsh crime because the victim was a gay male.

  4. Paul R says

    I’ve never felt that he was responsible for someone’s suicide, because suicide is a terrible decision that no one can really drive a person to do. But it should be mentioned that many of these comments are from conservative writers. To claim that he has a boatload of gay support is false. He should be shunned and imprisoned briefly, but deportation is stupid.

  5. Homo Genius says

    @ steve….

    i dont view it as harsh because to be honest I dont think Ravi commited any crime. Sorry. I just think its all nonsense. He cant really be held responsible for someone elses mental state. Had the victim not committed suicide and sued for various things or filed a complaint of some kind… fine. throw the book at Ravi.

    This has always smelled of a withchunt. but Im against “hate crimes” anyway.

  6. cwm says

    Not only was Clementi gay: also, he was decidedly not a fashionable or particularly handsome gay man. Which might explain some of the lack of sympathy, both outside and under the LGBT umbrella.

    Ah but Caylee Anthony was just adorable… See the difference?

  7. Nat says

    “i dont view it as harsh because to be honest I dont think Ravi commited any crime”

    Yes, he did. It’s not a subjective determination you get to make.

  8. Paul R says

    Oh yes, CWM, this is definitely all about looks. I know that looks are important to perceptions, especially in the gay world. But come on.

  9. cwm says

    Yeah, twelve people have already decided exactly which crimes Ravi committed.

    “Had the victim not committed suicide and sued for various things or filed a complaint of some kind…”

    Dead people can sue? WTF are you on about?

    This was not like the instance of Trayvon Martin’s family and supporters having to mount a campaign of protests and publicity before it became even possible to proceed. Ravi was indicted by a grand jury. If you believe it was a politicized process, you’ve got serious paranoia issues.

  10. Ken says

    Th man acted reprehensibly. I agree that he could not have know that Tyler would commit suicide. One theory of the law is that you take your victims where you find them. Thus, by picking on such a mental case, he is responsible for all of the consequences. More personally, I would support one full year in jail, followed by one full year serving gay and lesbian youth.

  11. Ken says

    Th man acted reprehensibly. I agree that he could not have know that Tyler would commit suicide. One theory of the law is that you take your victims where you find them. Thus, by picking on such a mental case, he is responsible for all of the consequences. More personally, I would support one full year in jail, followed by one full year serving gay and lesbian youth.

  12. cwm says

    Paul, I couldn’t agree more that it’s ridiculous. My opinion is based on a lot of victim-blaming talk I’ve encountered in the comments on gay blogs. Much of which trashed Clementi for being a violin-playing nerd: as if that (and his suicide) made it obvious: well, the kid was already circling the drain anyhow. Devaluing the victim went hand-in-hand with making excuses for Ravi, who after all was just a kid engaged in hijinks right?

  13. cwm says

    It might seem karmically perfect upon first consideration. But given Ravi’s history with Clementi–and his post-conviction media appearances, in which he attempted but failed to sound repentant–I don’t think LGBT youth should be subjected to Ravi’s help.

  14. Molc says

    These ppl are idiots. It’s not just state sanctioned homophobia we have to be wary of,it seems. Tyler did not commit suicide. He was murdered. Next these morons will be holding vigils for Matthew Shepard’s murderers. Truly sickening.

  15. NullNaught says

    Maximum sentence and deportation. None of those supporters speak for Clementi or his family; they can go f*ck themselves.
    Of course, kiwi misses the point, and turns it into something all about his own political statement. This isn’t about his view of Republicans. How self-centered can you get? I hope he one day realizeds not everything is all about him. What a dope.
    I know, kiwi, I have cappers the size of testes. Hahahaha; I slay myself.

  16. calvin says

    How many gay kids killed themselves since the Rutgers case? Has anyone been convicted? Why the why the media ignores them and still focuses on Ravi?
    Sorry for my english.

  17. says

    WHY ARE WE SUCH DOORMATS?!!!!

    WHY ARE WE SO WILLING TO “FORGIVE” THOSE WHO WOULD SLIT OUR THROATS AND ORDER LUNCH???!!!!!

    or to cut to the chase

    WHY DO WE HATE OURSELVES SO MUCH???!!!

    (Props to Virilene )

  18. Jay says

    I am so disappointed in these gay leaders defending Ravi. He deserves to serve jail time. His arrogance in refusing to accept an overly generous plea deal shows an appalling lack of remorse for his conduct. He may not be totally responsible for the death of Tyler Clementi, but he certainly contributed to it. He also needs to be deported.

  19. Jay says

    It is particularly outrageous that these self-appointed leaders of the gay community are saying that the hate crimes bill should be repealed. How many gay people have to die before crimes against us are taken seriously?

  20. Peter M. says

    And where is the support for the Clementi family?

    I’m sorry but I can’t understand this wave of support for Rhavi. He didn’t show any remorse for his actions and never acknowledged his part of responsability for what happened to Tyler Clementi. In my opinion justice has been served. He should be deported.

    And WTF is wrong with “gay rights activist Bill Dobbs”???:
    “The hate crime law in New Jersey has got so many problems that it should be repealed,” Dobbs said. Really?!!
    We are in deep trouble if our activists start to sound like Teabaggers.

  21. Continuum says

    Give him jail time.

    And, then deport him.

    Snotty, unpleasant man who thought it would be great fun to broadcast his gay roommate’s sex life.

    It is interesting to remember that Tyler had requested a room transfer before this incident, so it’s not hard to imagine what other tortures, deriding comments, etc Ravi was perpetrating.

    He did the crime, now let him do the time.

    Ravi gets no sympathy nor hand wringing from me.

  22. Bob R says

    Justice is revenge and always has been. What this creep did was reprehensible and I do think it was a hate crime. Were Clementi straight the entire episode would never have occurred. I don’t want to see his head on a pike, but I think he should do jail time and be deported. As for the comment about Clementi’s common looks, yeah, if he looked like Brad Pitt or Mark Wahlberg, the call for Ravi’s head would be almost unanimous for most gays, maybe even a few of the sympathetic pundits would not be as outraged.

  23. says

    Let’s all decide why someone who forced a gay to commit suicide should be handled? What a horrible fate. As gays can be victims, they are Salem Witch burners when circumstances are reversed. I think they should be let him out. Andrew Sullivan can pick him up.
    I think about gay parents. I fear too severe.

  24. says

    He should not be getting “gay support,” that’s for sure. That headline is now all over the Internet–what does it imply? That we support him and are against, who? Tyler? The actual victim of Ravi’s crime.

    By gay support they really mean, I hope, that some gay people support relatively light punishment for him. But even that trivializes Tyler’s death by puting Ravi in a victim’s light he doesn’t deserve. He could have easily avoided all this by acting like a decent human being, and, later, by accepting a plea deal.

    It’s telling that several of the “supporters” are those who oppose the whole idea of a hate crime, like Sullivan and Dobbs, who has even spoken against marriage equality. But to focus on Ravi’s punishment–because the events leading up to the crime were “complicated”–is another kind of simplification now that it’s permanently branded as “gay support” of someone whose actions contributed to the death of another human being.

    How about support of those who never would have behaved like Ravi chose to? How about support for those who are deliberately targeted for humiliation by thoughtless people with an overblown sense do entitlement?

  25. jamal49 says

    Circumstantial evidence does not a hate crime make. And, please, explain to me exactly what “hate crime” Dharun Ravi committed.

    I get it. Ravi broadcast over the internet remotely from his computer from the dorm room he and Tyler shared Tyler in intimate situations with another man. Humiliating, to be sure, but a “hate crime”? I’m not sure where the “hate” is.

    There is stupidity and insensitivity here, certainly, on the part of Ravi. But, where is the “hate”? I have yet to see any.

    Tyler Clementi’s suicide was tragic, but not one of us can say for certain why Tyler jumped off the GW bridge and plunged to his death, can we? Or, have I missed something completely?

    There was a note Tyler wrote, but the contents have never been revealed. There was a text message from Tyler right before he leaped from the bridge but it mentioned nothing of Ravi.

    Did I miss something in the news coverage that Ravi sent out messages about how much he hated gays and that gays deserved death? Did he get a gang together and attack Tyler, or rape him or beat him to death or cause Tyler severe injury?

    Has Ravi stood on the floor of some state’s legislature and slandered the very humanity of LGBT people, calling for their removal from society by imprisonment or death, or invoked obscure texts from some religion’s “holy” book toustify the continued oppression of gays and lesbians as “god’s will”?

    Has Ravi been an anti-LGBT activist, going from talk show to talk show and expressing the most vile lies about LGBT people under the guise of “free speech”?

    Again, I am not sure what “hate” crime was committed here. I see stupidity, insensitivity, arrogance, unbridled hubris. But, I don’t see any hate crime.

    Why? Because we simply do not know why Tyler Clementi jumped of the G.W. Bridge that night in 2010. No one here and not even the prosecutor can correctly claim that they know exactly what Tyler was thinking when he jumped to his death.

    Suicide is the ultimate act of desperation to escape one’s inner demons and personal torments. I am a survivor of bullying and abuse–physical (beatings and rape), emotional (rejection by family and classmates) and psychological (I am scum, a sinner, a pervert because I am queer)–and I many times wanted to commit suicide so great was the despair and constant humiliation I felt. But, I didn’t and I don’t know why.

    Some of the abuse I suffered as a child, then adolescent, would surely qualify today as “hate crimes”. There is great comfort that society has at least recognized what a crime against humanity the act of bullying is.

    But, I must ask again: what constitutes “hate”? And, what are the torments that a person suffers that compels them to commit suicide? Further, what are the causes of such torments and can it be proven absolutely that a stupid, insensitive prank by an arrogant, immature prick actually caused the suicide of a very sensitive, perhaps immature, gay man?

    I don’t want revenge. I want justice. I am not convinced that the trial and conviction of Dharun Ravi and his ultimate jail time and deportation constitute justice where Tyler Clementi and his tragic suicide are concerned.

  26. Iwontgrowup says

    There is a HUGE difference between revenge and punishment for an evil act. What comes next forgiving gay bashing? Do we turn the other cheek again and again.
    This kid’s arrogance and lack of remorse does not desrve any degree of sympathy.
    How many more tormented souls must be pushed over the edge before we punish the pushers. He and his excusers don’t feel he did anything wrong, he carries no guilt and expects to be forgiven. There is NO forgiveness for destroying the human spirit. Deport this bastard and make certain he can’t return.

  27. Bingo says

    It’s sad that some of the comments above are made by people who have only read the headlines and don’t know what actually happened. One example: Ravi posted nothing online. Nothing. Nor is it proper to describe what he did as “broadcast” his roommate’s sex life.

    But why let facts stand in the way of emoting?

  28. says

    @JAMAL49: I take some of your points, but you don’t have to shout hateful anti-gay slurs on the floor of a legislature (or some of your other examples) before committing a crime to be convicted of “bias intimidation.” It’s not outlandish–even for those who think he faces an overly severe sentence–for the jury to have seen bias intimidation in Ravi’s actions. He may not have hated Tyler because he was gay, but his deliberate intimidation of Tyler had clear anti-gay roots.

    A lesson for other people to learn is that when you target someone for deliberate humiliation, and that humiliation has tragic consequences–even if you obviously didn’t intend them–you will have to live with them. And, again, Ravi could have owned up to doing wrong via a plea bargain and have taken a much lighter (and, it would be hard to argue, unjust) punishment, but he chose not to.

    One hopes that whatever punishment he ultimately receives will make some other young people think twice about targeting others for humiliation. Because you can’t know fully what is in another’s mind, that should be more reason to treat everyone as you yourself would like to be treated. And if you don’t, your poor treatment of another person could impact the rest of your life.

  29. castaway says

    Stop it. Just stop it! Enough is enough. This kid has suffered enough already also. He knows what he did wasn’t right. Don’t pile decades of dogma and hatred on his sholders alone. The likelihood of him repeating this offense is zero! The lilkelihood of others repeating this offence, now with all this publicity, is nil. Thge point has been made. Forgiveness is gold. Just my opinion.

  30. Ricco says

    Essentially, VIRILENE, I am with you on this. It is his lack of remorse, his refusal to accept any culpability in the suicide of Tyler Clementi that most condemns me in his eyes.

    But that just makes him an A**hole, and if we start passing out long prison sentences for being an A**hole, than a lot of us would be in deep Sh . . . fecal matter!

    And Kiwi is right, he is being condemned for the very thing that wins republican politician votes.

    We have enough natural born A**holes in this country so I say deport his arrogant, remorseless a** back to India. That would not be so bad. He would only be there as long as it took for his arrogant family to purchase him a Canadian citizenship.

  31. Tony says

    Just because all these folks are well known doesn’t mean they’re right. I personally think they’re 100% wrong.

    I’m little surprised by some of names on that list. I’m not surprised Dan Savage and Andrew Sullivan are on it. Both are often wrong and never seem to review their opinions to see if maybe just maybe they might be wrong.

    I often wish both of them would just go away. And they can take the HRC with them.

  32. NullNaught says

    @Ricco
    Being remorseless is more than being an a$$hole, it is psychopathy. This guy is dangerous and needs to be kept out of society as long as possible; it won’t do him any good as he will never change, but it will keep us safer in the mean time.
    Kiwi is wrong. That is a reason to condemn Republicans, not to forgive psychopaths. Republicans do it for cynical political reasons. This guy did it because he is plain evil. There is a big diffence.
    How have you been? I haven’t seen you around recently and I miss you. Your posts are amongst my favorites.
    nullnaught@gmail.com if you care to chat away from here, that was my email.

  33. anon says

    The problem is that he’s likely to win on appeal and therefore make hate crimes always look vindictive rather than just. Also, the test for the prosecutor would have been what would have transpired had TC pressed charges instead of committing suicide. In all likelihood no criminal charges would have been forthcoming. A civil case would have been seen as small potatoes. He might have sued Rutgers, but what lawyer would have taken the case? TC was not only a doormat, per David E’s words, he was suicidal. If this was a crime worth prosecuting, the burden fell primarily on TC. In essence, the prosecutor was acting on his behalf. Now, a number of suicides do lead to trials of various sorts and the occasional prosecution, but the vast majority receive no attention (there’s a bit of a press blackout unless the person is young, gay or famous) and certainly no follow-through. In theory, we should see an increase in the number of invasion of privacy trial in the coming years, so watch that statistic.

  34. Davelandia says

    I can’t believe this little asswipe is getting support from anyone.

    The verdicts were what they were irrespective of the fact that Tyler committed suicide. The facts are, Ravi clearly did what he did, and he clearly did it because Tyler was with a dude – he tried to cover it up because he knew what he was doing – and then he attempted to portray himself as someone who didn’t know who gay people were and didn’t know any better – thinking the jury were idiots.

    He is completely guilty of every single one of the charges he was found guilty of, and he deserves what he gets – hopefully some jail time and a deportation.

    It was about time we had a judge, and a jury, that acted responsibly basing their evaluation of the case on facts, and not heartstrings (unlike the Brandon McInerny case).

    Bravo to this jury, bravo to the judge, and shame on those that have sympathy for this homophobic jerk.

  35. Ted says

    So gay leaders, pressing for the harshest possible treatment of people who target gays, are unhappy when they perceive that their political efforts in the judicial arena have caught someone in their trap that does not really measure up to the villainy. Now that this twink is being ground up by the system they created they realize it’s a little harsh. But they set this Pumpkinhead in motion, and they can’t stop it. It makes for good resume stuffing, puts a big feather in the cap of the prosecutor, rings that conviction and tough on crime bell real loud.

  36. says

    Ravi doesn’t have MY support!

    The bigot deserves prison. These softies are worried Ravi’s a scapegoat? They’re worried the Law is making an example of him?

    GUESS WHAT: That’s how Law + Punishment works! Prison is *supposed* to be a deterrent! Ravi committed crimes that resulted in a suicide. He deserves to be punished to the FULL extent of the Law.

  37. Swine says

    I’ve never heard anyone mention Tyler’s looks before. Certainly there was a lot of attention & sympathy when he committed suicide & at the time of the trial. But would there have been more attention & sympathy if he was hotter? Maybe, maybe not . . .

  38. Bill Michael says

    I’ve wondered many times if Clementi would have committed suicide anyway, as in, even if he had never been taped by Ravi. This is a question that bugs me. Was there some other reason at work for which Clementi would have committed suicide?

  39. jimmy palmieri says

    I am shocked at the Uncle Tom attitude that some of these activists and people of “knowledge: have taken. The fact is Clemente is dead. The fact is it is because of Ravis actions. The fact is Ravi gets to live, his family gets to hug him. The fact is Clemente is dead, leaving behind grieving loved ones.

    Support for Ravi by the LGBT community? INSANE. I no longer want to be the doormat, the little kid laughed at and tormented by the word fag, or the shy guy afraid to speak his mind in the name of injustice.
    RAVI AND HIS ACCOMPLICE SHOULD ROT IN A CELL FOR ALL I CARE. MY HEART IS ON THE SIDE OF A DEAD GAY BROTHER, ONCE AGAIN MADE TO BE SECOND CLASS, BY SOME OF HIS OWN COMMUNITY AND CALLED FAGGOT FROM THE GRAVE.
    Savage U is off my radar now. The others…..SHAME ON YOU.

  40. Kevin Donohue says

    I was in favor of lenience for Dharun until I saw his interview with Chris Cuomo. He was answering off the record questions he had refused to answer under oath, and seemed to absolve himself of any and all responsibility in this matter – including his attempts to tamper with witnesses and destroy evidence. I realized then that this kid is a sociopath. Perhaps a long prison sentence isn’t in order, but the sooner he is ushered out of this country the better. He has amply demonstrated a total lack of empathy and a complete willingness to manipulate others; I now find it impossible to give him the benefit of the doubt.

  41. Jay says

    We need someone to protect us from our leaders. Dharun Ravi was not convicted for killing Tyler Clementi. He was convicted for spying on Clementi, taping a sexual encounter, then lying to officials about his actions, destroying evidence, and attempting to suborn perjury. He rejected a more than generous plea offer, thinking he would get a bigoted jury and therefore escape with no punishment at all. He deserves jail time and then to be deported. We are not talking about ten years, a year and a half would be just.

  42. homoesq says

    i never comment, but reading all the comments, these lines of thought that boil down to belief that Ravi is paying the price from not accepting some plea bargain really miss the point. The point of the criminal justice system is not to force people to plea bargain their rights away. And the American way is not to presume people guilty.

    With crimes people should not be punished for the outcomes unless the outcomes are intended or foreseeable and likely. I’m not even sure he set up the embarrassing situation. All he did was post something he found, and then lets not forget the major crime of obstruction of justice – because he removed what he posted? In what twisted mind does that constitute obstructing justice?

  43. EM says

    “And where is the support for the Clementi family?”

    Well they won’t get any, naturally, because now the world has had to find out their GAY son (shock!)…liked SEX with sssh other MEN. So the public at large will only be interested in doe-eyed, sexless boyman Ravi, biting his nails looking as if butter wouldn’t melt.

  44. GeorgeM says

    So what homoesq he should just go home like nothing happened? He led people to watch what he “found”, he led embarrassment. I’m not sure he should do time but unlike you I think he should get probation and not walk around thinking he did nothing to this guy.
    To much sympathy in the gay community, forgive yes forget… No

  45. Beg to differ says

    @HOMOESQ

    You’re mistaken. Ravi invaded Clementi’s privacy once then attempted to do that a second time so his state of mind is clear. He didn’t accidentally do this. He intended to do it. His bias was proven by statements he made. After the suicide, he destroyed evidence and coached at least one witness. Destroying evidence and coaching a witness are crimes and they indicate consciousness of guilt. Someone who believes he has not done anything wrong does not destroy evidence or tamper with witnesses. Ravi was not charged with any crime related to Clementi’s suicide so whether that was foreseeable is irrelevant.

    A telling detail in this case is that the jury had to consider something like 30 counts, give or take, and they came back with a verdict in less than 48 hours. This was an easy decision for them. Unlike these gay pundits, the jury heard ALL of the evidence in this case so I think we can rely on their view to the exclusion of other, far less informed opinions.

  46. Satya Dosapati says

    Hi,

    I am one of the activists working in support of Dharun Ravi. I am sorry to hear the false statements of Ravi has no remorse and he has to be punished because ‘tough luck, he did not accept lighter appeal’. Ravi himself said he deserves punishment and we need to applaud him for not accepting appeal because it requires him to say he hate gay people. Common folks, I am not anyway undermining the loss of their son to Clementi family, be it gay or not, it is loss of a child. But we seem to insensitive to another tragedy unfolding itself, which we have a say, at least now. About Dharun not showing remorse, did you see reaction from him after his conviction. Let us not lose Dharun. He will be a great asset to educate other youngsters on how thoughtless actions can have serious consequences, to others and to themselves. I have suggested that Dharun and perhaps some others including should be spokes persons for Tyler Clementi Foundation. Let us have a positive outcome of the tragedy.

    Regards,
    Satya Dosapati

  47. jomicur says

    Why on earth did our community work for years–for decades–to get hate crimes laws passed if we’re now going to argue that people who commit anti-gay hate crimes shouldn’t be punished? Why did thousands of us, TENS of thousands of us, lobby state and federal legislators if Ravi should get a pass? To argue that is to tacitly concede that our opponents were all perfectly right in arguing that no such law was needed.

    And to look at it with a slightly wider perspective, using the same reasoning the McGreevey and Savage use, NO criminals should ever be punished for any offense. That, to put it mildly, is lunacy, and an especially foolish brand of lunacy at that.

  48. says

    I think there is a solution to this issue:

    Give Ravi the full penalty, but suspend the sentence. He was 18 and pulled a college prank. He violated Tyler’s privacy to be sure and should be penalized for it. This was not a typical case of bullying a teen to his death. Tyler was also 18. So it’s hard to label it as typical “bullying.”

    I think Ravi should face some punishment for certain, but perhaps serving LGBT youth, or going to college campuses to generate awareness of how pranks can become lethal, or even serving in an LGBT homeless youth center…

    To me, given the extenuating (and very unique and specific) circumstances, it just seems futile to deport or lock him up and throw away the key. Surely there is a wiser use of what’s left of Ravi’s life that can be translated into a sentence that actually benefit the LGBT community in a positive manner….

  49. NullNaught says

    @Satya Dosapati
    You are indian, just like Ravi, and nothing like the Clementis. You don’t have justice in mind here, you are and advocate for any indian who commits a crime and is threatened with deportation. Maybe Ravi should have thought of the posibility of deportation before he bullied a boy to death!
    Are you even gay? Or are you just one of those straight trolls showing up here to make an a$$ of yourself? Because you look to be the later. You won’t even respond to this because you did a totally disrespectful hit-and-run didn’t you? You droped a bomb and ran. Your words mean little to nothing in the gay community.

  50. NullNaught says

    @Brian Anthony Bowen
    Ravi has conceded no responsibility, shown no remorse. This is the psychopathy. This was surely a case of bullying him to death; Clementi tried to escape from Ravi before this incident. I think you are soft on homophobia and I can’t understand why.
    I don’t mean this offensively, but are you another of those straight advocates for Ravi like Satya Dosapati? I only ask because for a gay person you show little outrage. I suppose you could be a gay person who never was bullied? I find that hard to believe… What’s up with you?

  51. David says

    Bullied gay teens who are now dead have left behind suicide notes stating that they could not get help of any kind from anyone. Not even gay advocacy groups would help them.
    Yet “gay activists” have no problem expressing support for a bastard who intentionally set out to harm a young gay man–those actions resulted in the gay man’s death.
    Shame on them.

  52. Keith says

    Now Ravi wants a re-trial. He still admits no wrong doing and refuses to accept that he has been duly convicted of crimes. His lawyers see this sympathy pouring out and now want a new jury who have heard all of this. He still wants to get off without any admission of any wrong doing.

    These so-called gay leaders are doing no one any good. They are making a joke of the hate crime laws they have fought for.

  53. rayy says

    I don’t understand all the hand-wringing over this guy who harassed another guy into suicide. At a minimum, he is guilty of callous disregard. But I believe it goes farther than that. Actions have consequences and yeah, you could say the penalty/charges would not be the same if he had not died. But he did.

    Why “debonaire” editor? Does that opinion have any bearing on the story?

  54. Jay says

    Virilene nailed it in the first comment. I will just add that the evidence against this little creep was overwhelming. A jury deliberated for twelve hours and found him guilty of most of the counts against him. He lied to authorities. He tampered with evidence. He attempted to suborn others to lie and to destroy evidence. He consistently used anti-gay slurs (evidence of bias). And he sneered at the plea deal, apparently thinking that he could find a jury that would buy the bogus story that he was just playing a prank or that he was protecting his property. Luckily, the jurors were smarter than our so-called leaders. What a license to bully it would be if this entitled little prick got off scot-free because people like Dan Savage and Andrew Sullivan thought it unfair that he might actually have to pay for his crimes. See the blog at glbtq.com by Claude Summers on this issue.

  55. Jay says

    homoesq writes: “The point of the criminal justice system is not to force people to plea bargain their rights away. And the American way is not to presume people guilty.”

    Yes. But if one rejects a plea bargain and goes to trial, knowing the consequences of being convicted, then if you are convicted you can hardly say you have been railroaded. Ravi is not the victim here. He knowingly humiliated a young man and then lied about it and attempted to get others to lie about it. He deserves jail time and then he should be deported. (Just as he had an opportunity to avoid jail time by accepting a plea deal, he also had an opportunity to apply for American citizenship. He and his family chose not to do so. He deserves to be deported to his country of citizenship, India. In fact, I think it more important that he be deported than that he serve a long prison term.)

  56. RuhRoh says

    I see the usual mind-boggling racism in the comments on this site have reached a new low. The many comments calling for deportation are pretty telling. The “you are Indian” craziness from Nullnaught just puts it over the top. When did gay men start sounding so much like Jan Brewer?

  57. Jay says

    Ruhroh: you think it is racist to call for the deportation of a convicted felon? Ravi had every opportunity to apply for American citizenship: he chose not to do so. He should be deported.

  58. NVTodd says

    30 days ? Really ?

    No apology, no sign of remorse.

    It’s not racist to want justice, it’s not racist to want Ravi deported.

    And I’m never going to forget the gay apologists for supporting this miscarriage of justice.

    Enough of oppressing ourselves and the people that take part in it.

  59. RuhRoh says

    Jay: I do find the many calls on here for his deportation to be creepy and racist, yes. I am not so much defending him, as despairing at the attitude struck by so many on here and the ugly sentiments they freely express. Why the rage at gay commentators, activists, and public figures simply for calling for justice, rather than revenge? But even if you disagree, why the intense focus on deportation? Why the immediate dismissal of one of the commenters on here for being (presumably) Indian? And, frankly, I only felt the need to express this despair with the level of discourse on here, because it seems to be the norm. Is there ever a post on here about black people or Muslims that does not predictably bring forth a string of cringe-inducing comments that would be right at home on the Fox News site?

  60. chub4bears says

    Just as we have gay Republicans, many gay people support and promote people who feel and say and do things against gay people. Ravi has shown great anti-gay bias, and an extreme disregard for the feelings of mr. Clementi and the man he was with. Ravi also was convicted of witness tampering, desrtuction of evidence, obstruction of justice and lying to police. His arrogance at turning down 2 plea bargains and refusal to admit or show any remorse during the sentencing shows he is unworthy of the support of traitors to our community.

  61. John Rechy says

    Support by so-called “gay leaders”–and by other gay people–of this quintessential bully, Ravi,is a disgusting manifestation of the entrenched self-hatred that some gay people are still afflicted with. The one-month jail sentence is an additional outrage.

  62. John Rechy says

    Who are these self-appointed “gay leaders” who have done so much to lessen the impact of anti-bullying efforts by protesting Ravi’s prosecution? They have given “straight” media a terrific headline, proclaiming falsely that even gay people are complicit in outrages like this one. They have set back all anti-bullying campaigns with their roles as collaborators. Once again, self-hatred asserts itself in all its ugly manifestations.

    –John Rechy

Leave A Reply