Wingnut Austin Ruse Believes Gay Rights Movement Should Be ‘Embarrassed’ By Transgender People

Austinruse

Austin Ruse, the president of the Catholic Family and Human Rights Institute, cannot seem to fathom how gay rights leaders would want to involve themselves with transgender individuals. Following ENDA's passage in the Senate, Ruse spoke out, in typically conspiratorial fashion, about a future of quotas for transgender employees, whom he claims have "psychological disturbances."

Right Wing Watch posted Ruse's inflammatory statements:

Race hustlers everywhere know exactly where this is headed, toward self-imposed quotas by businesses large and small. The only way a business can inoculate itself against charges of discriminatory hiring practices is to hire the aggrieved class no matter what. If pushed by the Justice Department, Hobby Lobby’s only line of defense would be to trot out the transsexuals. They don’t even have to know how to type as long as they have lopped off their penises or at least wear dresses.

One of the truly strange things about the gay-rights movement is how free they are with their strangest cousins. You would think that even gay men and lesbians might be rather embarrassed by the T in LGBT. But so bold are they, so fearless, that they now lead with the T. Most Americans are rightly put off by such displays of obvious psychological disturbances.

After spitting his racist, homophobic, and entirely disrespectful rhetoric, Ruse expressed hope that Congress will see fit to bring down ENDA.

Comments

  1. Tyler says

    A lot of the trolls on this site agree with Ruse, and call transgender people horrible names such as freak. This is the company they keep, and they are no better than this man. Hate is ugly no matter the source.

  2. says

    well, there are some gay people who are embarrassed by transpeople, and hate them.
    the good news? they’re the most uselessly pathetic members of our community, they have no actual lives, and their hatred is limited solely to anonymously spewing anti-trans hatred on internet messageboards.

    Just wait for it – two trolls, using about 6 screen names each, will flood this to prove me right. NONE, however, will have the balls to put a face and name to their comments.

    Anti-trans gay men are, thankfully, such massive cowards that their hatred exits only in online text.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJom6vyRtQc
    look. some non-trans people who support them as brothers and sisters. it’s what people with integrity do.

  3. Nathan says

    I definitely dont think Transgender people are freaks, but they are definitely not the same as gay people. Most gay people do not think the “T” should be part of our civil rights crusade. Transgender are just as foreign to gay people as they are to straight people. Let’s not confuse thinking they are “other” with hatred because they are not the same.

  4. Robert says

    Does anybody anywhere understand the difference between HIRING practices and FIRING practices? Under ENDA, no one will be compelled to hire anyone. But they will be compelled not to discriminate among their employees. This is the LGBT version of Death Panels…

  5. Tiger says

    I don’t think their issues are OUR issues, but I also would never, ever be embarrassed in any way to be mistaken for or associated with a transgendered person.

  6. endorisha says

    There are some people on this site who try to shut down discussion about issues and concerns with transgender topics and persons by labeling everyone who doesn’t agree with the pop-doctrine a bigot.

    But a gay person’s opinions about trangendered people or doctrine don’t mean that the t-gurl isn’t part of the family, anymore than thinking that Aunt Dierdre is a bltch or cousin Sally is a bit off her rocker makes them less a member of the family. At least, that’s how we do things in the South.

    Shouting people down and calling them names doesn’t make you superior Kiwi, it just makes you the center of attention, which is why you do it, isn’t it?

  7. Robert says

    Nathan/Norman,
    I couldn’t disagree with you more. LGB&T people have all been oppressed/mistreated/etc. because of our sexual orientation/identity. By your reasoning, we could separate L’s from G’s from B’s, or maybe separate butch from femme, or urban from rural…as sexual minorities, we are all one community, embracing all our differences as well as all that we have in common. Strength in numbers, remember. You think a violent homophobe wouldn’t attack a transgender person any more or less readily that a gay man or a lesbian? I don’t.

  8. disgusted american says

    as a gya man – I dont pretend to understand or know – WHY people are transgendered, but Im of a “Live and Let let mentality” ….so, a fight for RIGHTS , is a Fight for ALL of OUR RIGHTS LGBTQ people as well!!!!!

  9. Hey Darlin' says

    Unlike some other groups, like anti-gay fringe groups lets say, gay groups and organizations really encompass every social group and ethnic makeup on the planet.

    We transcend all boundaries, even the ones you would seek to impose, you would do well to follow our lead.

  10. Thedrdonna says

    Hey Nathan, you say “most” gay people don’t want trans folks included in the movement. Care to back that up? Got any polls, studies, anything? Or are you just talking out of your butt?

  11. Derrick from Philly says

    With the exception of Transsexuals and Hetero Cross Dressers, Transgender folk are connected to Gay people–always have been.

    And, of course, some surgically transitioned Transsexuals may have same sex attaction, and that makes them GAY!!!YEY, YEY, YEY!!!!

  12. Matthew says

    He is wrong that gay people should be embarrassed by Ts. We shouldn’t be embarrassed because gay people are not responsible for what Ts do. We should be embarrassed that we have allowed ourselves to be bamboozled into the bogus LGBT concept.

    LGBs are not “one people” with a disparate group of mostly heterosexual transsexuals, crossdressers, and hermaphrodites. There is no inherent bond. The standard justification is that “our enemies are the same.” But even if that were true (and it is a simplistic overgeneralization), it depends entirely on the feelings and beliefs of homophobes. We should never define ourselves based on what bigots think at some point in time, nor should we link ourselves with groups because bigots think we are linked.

    LGBT has been a disaster for LGBs and for Ts. Let it end.

  13. Fenrox says

    Of course they belong, they are getting the exact same treatment we did, jerks don’t believe that they are real. They didn’t believe that we were real, they thought we were lying to ourselves or others for attention/satan, etc. And they are pushing the same lies and crap on trans people.

    To the people who think that our cause is too different to be associated with Trans, you operate from a false reality where a groups definition is prescriptive instead of descriptive. The idea of us all being so different is an illusion. So any rational or logical or kind or patient person would see that they are the same as us.

    However, one day theoretically the trans group will become a much larger group and might branch off, probably not, also probably moot.

  14. Mikey says

    I think that these people know the battle against gay rights is lost, and that transgender rights is next up. They suppose splitting the two of us up will weaken us.

    The transgender community stood by the gay community. I, personally, will not stop fighting for them.

  15. Logan says

    Ray wrote: “I was raised by parents that taught me empathy and compassion”.

    Are those the same parents that created an environment so unwelcoming to their gay child that he wished he would just die (a story from Ray himself) because he was gay and didn’t want to be? Yeah, I thought so.

  16. GuyOnYourRight says

    @ Little Kiwi. “…they’re the most uselessly pathetic members of our community”

    – I don’t even necessarily think that they are a part of our community. I think more often than not, they’re anti-gay straight people who are impostors; they’re posturing as gay in order to get reactions like,
    “…pathetic… they have no actual lives…” etc out of us.

    They’re the people who come on here and suggest every gay-basher is somehow a self-loathing closet gay. It’s meant to demoralize us, to make us think that we can’t even count on ourselves.

    Nathan revealed him-herself as one of those impostors by referring to our equal rights movement as a “crusade”.

    The people who posture as gay and then spew anti-gay drivel are highly suspect as far as I’m concerned.

  17. CPT_Doom says

    As a gay man, I don’t “get” being transgender. Then again, as a gay man, I don’t “get” being straight either. I still believe that the movement must be LGBT, and even add the I (for “intersex”). That’s because all these groups – L, G, B, T, and I – are attacked, vilified, and dehumanized by the right-wing for the same reason: we fail to conform to their strict gender norms. Without the national obsession with masculinity and femininity and whether an individual is expressing the “right” proportion of each, we would not have any issues in society.

  18. says

    I’ve been pretty open and honest about my journey thus far, Troll Logan Who Is Obsessed With Me. A few of my videos with my parents have been featured on this site. They created a great home environment – it was the outside one that negatively affected me. This is why I, unlike many others, Came Out to my family before I came out to my peers. It was their strength that gave me the courage to do so, and to continue to live my life the way I live it.

    😀

    I’m sorry that you’ve yet to find, as an adult, the strength and courage I found as a high school student.

  19. Fenrox says

    Also, people seem to get really, REALLY hung up on trans activism as proof to drop trans people. That is just garbage. No group is it’s loudest most controversial member or trans people honestly shouldn’t socialize with our bug-chasing, murder-suicide, drug fueled racist selves.

    There is a parable in the bible that applies here, now forgive me i forget all the names. King dude was a rich dude who would hear monetary complaints from his citizens and dole out punishment and reward justly. One day a man appeals to the dude “Please, you must help me, my crops were destroyed and I have no money for my bills and taxes and I will be sold into slavery!” The King dude decided to help this man and absolved his debt. Some time later the king hears that the same man is now harshly demanding payment from people he lent money too and/or buying these debtors into slavery. The king, outraged asks why this man knows nothing of mercy when he himself was shown it. The man replies, “What is mercy if not slavery, I came to you to be saved from slavery, not subjected into it by being beholden to you forever.”

    I think god ends up killing the dude because god is a jerk like that, but the moral is that people are people and expecting them to act a certain way just makes a fool out of you. The idea that things have to be fair is an illusion you create and buy into yourself.

  20. Matthew says

    Mikey, the “trans community” has never brought anything to the table since LGBT was contrived in the 1990s. They don’t donate or volunteer at meaningful levels. They couldn’t care less about gay civil rights. They are overtly hostile to the idea of gay civil rights, except as a vehicle to be used to pass trans rights. If a gay civil rights bill does not include transgender bathroom selection, then they are not only indifferent to it, they actively urge its defeat. They demand that all gay organizations, even ones that have existed for decades and which are entirely funded and run by gay people, be converted into “LGBT” organizations in which they have co-ownership. But at the same time, they keep their own T-only, segregated organizations AND demand that gay people fund those as well.

    LGBT is one of the the biggest scam in modern political history. And for a scam to work, it requires a certain number of low-information, highly deluded marks. Congratulations, Mikey. You are the mark.

  21. Bill says

    Nathan/Norman — Good on ya for expressing your opinion.

    Little Kiwi’s name is Raymond Miller. He is a failed actor from a wealthy family in Toronto. He is dealing with a prematurely aging face and body and male pattern baldness. More importantly, he is unhinged. He regularly urges people with whom he disagrees to kill themselves, often suggesting specific violent methods. For anyone to talk like this, especially to other gay people, is sick. He has removed himself from civil discourse and should be ignored.

  22. Jason B. says

    Everyday I find myself judging someone for something, every time I do that I ask myself why when the issue has no impact on my life, it’s not harming anyone or society. It’s a challenge to change our nature to pass judgement on people for whatever inane perceived injustice against our sensibilities we experience. However, if we all tried everyday to ask how the offending item or circumstance truly impacts our individual lives and withheld any negativity towards those that the answer is, it doesn’t; life would be more pleasant for all.

    This falls within that category.

  23. says

    It’s not an overgeneralization to say that the opposition to gay people and transgender people is coming from the same place. It’s basic fact. Look at any organization that is working against gay rights and see that they are also opposed to trans rights. Any organization working against trans rights is also full of homophobes.

    It’s ludicrous, however, to pretend that trans-inclusiveness depends on letting the enemy define us. Anyone who thinks that gender identity and presentation isn’t an issue many many gay people can relate to has their heads in the sand and is ignorant of our common history. Most gay people, contrary to Nathan’s assertion, stand in solidarity with our trans brothers and sisters and have no embarrassment over the T in LGBT. This is especially true of younger people, though gender identity has been part of the gay movement since long before there was a gay movement, much less an LGBT movement.

    Ruse and his ilk would like nothing better than to create a wedge between gay and trans people–it serves their purpose to distract and divide our community just as NOM aimed to distract and divide by creating a wedge between gay and black. They’d prefer we fight each other rather than fight them and for the gullible few, it’s successful.

    When you oppose civil rights for the transgender community you’re in bed with the homophobes and working against LGB people at the same time.

  24. Logan says

    No, Ray not obsessed with you but you can keep on dreaming. I just find humor with sad people like you with your thinly veiled facade that you are Mr. tough guy when really you are a hot mess, and you know it!

    Now Ray’s lame retort that he thinks is really clever, 3, 2, 1…

  25. says

    *elegant curtsy*
    middle-class family, btw :-) and no matter what arrows you try and fail to sling at me, one thing remains – i’m unafraid to be who i am, and you’re terrified of being who you are.

    those who can’t tell the truth about themselves instead choose to make up lies about others :)

    if you’re all so strong in your anti-trans opinions, raise your visibility with them to match mine. but’cha CAN’T, Blanche! 😀

  26. Fenrox says

    @Matthew take a damn gay history class, who do you think were at the Stonewall on that historic night? Who were more than 35% of the opening GAA group? Does John Waters work mean nothing? Brandon Teena’s heartbreaking death? Chevalier d’Eon awesome life?

    Just because you are a bigot who doesn’t want to lean his own history doesn’t mean that it isn’t there.

  27. Derrick from Philly says

    Matthew,

    when did you come out and where did you come out? I’m curious (well, a little curious) about Gay men who have had no relationship to Transfolk. I don’t understand how that could be UNLESS you deliberately segregated yourself from Transgender folk. How could you go to a Gay Pride Celebration or a Gay street festival and not come in contact with Transgender people?

    I’ve always known there were Gay men (and Gay women, I guess) who were bigots against Transgender people–going all the way back to the 1970s (long before the word “Transgender” was used). The Gay bigots were the most boring of Gay people–no real enlightenment, no personalities, no wit or humor….nothing except genitals.

  28. Luke says

    I don’t harbor animosity toward transgender people, but I think their issues are distinct from sexual orientation issues. I think blurring their issues with LGB issues causes confusion and reinforces archaic stereotypes about gay and bisexual people.

  29. TheDrDonna says

    Hey Ernie, you say “Most gay people, contrary to Nathan’s assertion, stand in solidarity with our trans brothers and sisters and have no embarrassment over the T in LGBT.”

    Care to back that up? Got any polls, studies, anything? Or are you just talking out of your butt?

  30. David H. says

    Disturbing to read some of the comments above trying to justify LGBT by promoting stereotypes of gay men as fem and not real men. Really kind of shows you how reactionary LGBT really is. It is based on stereotypes. We spent many years educating the world that those stereotypes are false and now we have LGBT come along to say that they are true. Sick.

  31. Derrick from Philly says

    Another imposter. The above comment couldn’t have come from THEDRDONNA who appreciates open-minded Gay folks united with Transgender folks.

    Rick, you are ridiculous.

  32. Fenrox says

    @David? What are you talking about? It sounds like you had an idealized view of your own group and are now facing the reality of that group, that they are in every way the same kinda jerks, racists and amazing people that exist everywhere, in every group. It can be tough, it’s natural to think highly of your own group but they are really all the same.

  33. TheDrDonna says

    Derrick, that was from me. I appreciate all opinions, but I also ask for evidence. I don’t ask for evidence from just one side. That would be intellectually dishonest.

  34. says

    hey troll wimps! “archaic stereotypes”?

    Here, let a guy with actual balls help you out with that…*ahem*

    next time the stereotype-slinging bigots you call family assume that you’re transgendered because you’re gay (i’m guessing that’s the pathetic argument you’re trying to make) you can simply say this>

    *ahem*

    “No, I’m not transgendered. However, transgendered people continue to face unfair discrimination both in policy and in our every day culture. So while our struggles are not the same, they do have very similar parallels, and I as a gay man understand the strength in numbers, so you can join me in standing strong with them , and the rest of the diverse LGBT Communities, by creating a culture of understanding, empathy and equality.”

    It might be a nice break from your usual discussions of “derp derp derp DURRRRP”

    Real men stand strong with their trans brothers and sisters. Modern-day eunuchs denigrate them online, anonymously.

  35. Daniel Berry, NYC says

    People like Nathan are so narcissistic that they believe that what “they” think – or are afraid of – is what everyone thinks – or is afraid of. He seems, meanwhile, to believe that trans folk aren’t entitled to having their rights protected. Or something. He’s the same kind of low-life that “Mr” Ruse is.

  36. Thedrdonna says

    Ah, good to see I’m finally worth mimicking. I feel like now I’m a fully fledged Towleroad commenter! Regarding people’s statements on how the LGB community feels about the T, I figure that since most gender and sexual minority-rights groups include T folks under their umbrella the implication is that most LGB folks, who from the vast majority of the LGBT movement, are ok with trans folks. Nathan is the one presenting claims that counteract that, and so the onus falls on him to prove them.

  37. Daniel Berry, NYC says

    @Fenrox: thanks for saying it: “Matthew” knows NOTHING. I knew Marsha P Johnson and Sylvia Rivera and other of the drag queens who threw rocks at the cops outside the Stonewall Inn that hot June night in 1969. Evidently “Matthew” thinks the gay rights movement was brought in by hunky muscular useless little drug-queens rather than by the drag queens who were first to stand up for ALL OF US.

  38. Thedrdonna says

    I don’t require evidence when people state that climate change is real, either-that’s common knowledge and anyone who frames it as a “debate” between two equal viewpoints is giving credibility to fringe folks pursuing their own agenda.

  39. Fenrox says

    @Daniel, I honestly think people think transgender has only existed as long as the word transgender has (Which is like 1990).

    The sad thing is that there are tons of uppity, white, racist, opinionated POS gay people in history for these guys to glom onto as heroes and visionaries. They know so little about themselves.

  40. says

    I’m a gay man in favor of trans rights because
    1) openly-trans people do not pose a threat to anyone’s existence or livelihood by their gender identity.
    2) openly-trans people should be assumed as productive members of society, no matter their identity.
    3) Simone de Beauvoir’s quote – “one is not born a woman but becomes one” – applies just as well to trans identity as it does to cisgender identity. Existence precedes essence, and taking a institutionally gender-neutral, inclusive approach to this is the best practice for any institution.

  41. Rick says

    “Disturbing to read some of the comments above trying to justify LGBT by promoting stereotypes of gay men as fem and not real men. Really kind of shows you how reactionary LGBT really is. It is based on stereotypes. We spent many years educating the world that those stereotypes are false and now we have LGBT come along to say that they are true. Sick. ”
    .

    Bingo. And this is the key to understanding this whole issue. The real divide is between “gender-non-conformists”–which consists of effeminate gay men and “trans” people, on the one hand–whose futile goal is to destroy standards of masculinity and make cowardice and mimickry of women acceptable behavior for men……….and all other gay men and most lesbians, on the other hand–whose goal is simply to eradicate homophobia and gain acceptance for gay people in the social mainstream.

    The former group consists of men who have internalized the belief foisted upon us by homophobic straight society that being attracted to men sexually equates to being deficient in masculinity or completely devoid of masculinity and they therefore believe fundamentally that all gay men are cowards and sissies.

    The latter group consists of men who have rejected the notion that homosexuality and masculinity are incompatible and instead believe that they are not only compatible, but natural outgrowths of each other.

    The two views are completely incompatible and the reason all this is coming to a head now is because society has decided to accept homosexuality, but is–rightly–unwilling to accept effeminate behavior in men.

    Those of us who are gay therefore have a choice and that choice is actually what the man who is the subject of this story is presenting us: Choose to be normal men and we will incorporate homosexuality into the definition of what we consider to be normal behavior for men……choose, however, to be “gender-non-conformists” and try to destroy masculine values and we will reject you outright, homosexuality and all.

    The choice could not be clearer.

  42. Francis #1 says

    It’s sad when one troll uses several different user names with the intent to bring down an entire conversation…and is allowed to achieve that goal with ease.

    Anyway, most gay men I know aren’t transphobic and are definitely pro-trans equality, and that’s because unlike this idiot Austin Ruse, we don’t grow up in a heteronormative/cisnormative world that men like he does. We’re rejected from that very culture because of our orientation, so why wouldn’t I, we as gay men, support our trans brothers and sisters, many of whom are NOT straight to begin with?

  43. endorisha says

    There are so many more important issues.
    We need to stop illegal immigration.
    We need to deport the illegal aliens.
    We need to pass a national affirmation of the Second Amendment so the citizens of California and Illinois and DC can have their rights restored.
    We need to reduce welfare by 10% per year until it’s gone.

  44. Fenrox says

    @Rick, your choice is entirely built on and for a “normalized society” that doesn’t exist. Give an example in reality, that isn’t full of obvious faults in logic and classification.

    Bigots, it isn’t hard to be a great bigot, you just have to hammer away at uncertainty. All this make believe is just flailing, do a better job.

  45. Thedrdonna says

    Endorisha, you’re obviously right! We need to pursue one, and only one, goal as a society, and once it is COMPLETELY RESOLVED FOREVER (like once we’ve killed all the Poors), then we go to the next most important thing.

    You’re an evolutionary dead end.

  46. William says

    “They don’t even have to know how to type as long as they have lopped off their penises or at least wear dresses.”

    Haha! At the risk of playing on stereotypes, I’m pretty sure the odds that they can type are pretty strong!

  47. jimbryant says

    Transgenders should be treated with respect, just as all decent, law-abiding people should be treated with respect.

    However, transgenders are not gay. Many of them do not want to be thought of as gay. They are the opposite to gay because they run away from being men who love men. They wish to be women who love men.

    Transgenders need to be told that enough’s enough.

  48. Derrick from Philly says

    THEDRDONNA:

    That isn’t any damn ENDORISHA. That’s Rick as David Hagatha Hearne as Endorisha.

    This place is really getting crazy, Andy.

    lol @ “….all this is coming to a head now is because society has decided to accept homosexuality, but is–rightly–unwilling to accept effeminate behavior in men.”

    LOL. Rick, you used to make me angry, NOW you make me laugh. You’re one crazy motha’ f.cka’. I’ve already told you that if I ever find out where you live–I’m going to pay some Transwomen to find you and whup the sh.t out of your azz.

  49. anon says

    A huge issue here is the tiny numbers of trans folks to start with. It’s depressing enough to go to one sparsely attended “gay” event after enough. A national trans event would probably fit into a diner. There’s almost no trans “culture” either. No bars, theaters, musicals, songs. Only a handful of out celebrities and athletes. Politicians you can count on one hand. They simply don’t have the numbers to make a cause of their own and/or aid the overall gay cause either. There’s never going to be a trans pride parade or a trans march on DC.

  50. Rick says

    “A huge issue here is the tiny numbers of trans folks to start with”

    Which makes it even more absurd that gay people are willing to continue to allow them onto our boat, with all the severe damage they are causing us in terms of confusing our message and reinforcing stereotypes that we fought so hard for decades to destroy.

    How absurd is it for 30 million gay people to have our public image tainted and our chances of social acceptance diminished by being linked to a tiny, tiny number of mentally disturbed individuals.

    The only explanation for such an association is that “trans” people are simply an extreme version of “gender-non-conforming” gay men, who feel an affinity for each other because they both fundamentally model their behavior on women, in sharp constrast to the rest of us who find that behavior utterly bizarre, incomprehensible, and self-defeating.

  51. Tyler says

    JimBryant, Rick has said that exact same thing before. Rick, your aliases are easily spotted, and if anything they make your points even more pathetic. Do the world a favor and get lost.

  52. Thedrdonna says

    Derrick, ahh, gotcha. Those did seem like suspiciously right-wing political goals. Must be one of those mythical gay-conservative unicorns I’ve heard the right crowing about.

    Anon, just because you aren’t aware of things going on doesn’t mean they don’t exist. I’ve participated in Trans March in SF, and there were thousands of us there. I’m involved in my local trans community too-you aren’t aware of our existence because you’re wearing blinders of your own devising.

  53. Tyler says

    How absurd is it for 30 million gay people to have our public image tainted and our chances of social acceptance diminished by being linked to a tiny, tiny number of mentally disturbed individuals.”

    Rick, we all think the same thing when people like you spout your misogynist, homophobic, anti-effeminacy and racist drivel under various names on this site. No self respecting member of the LGBT community would willingly associate with you, online or in real life.

  54. jimbryant says

    Rick,

    Everybody deserves rights and respect. What I don’t like is transgenders coming in under the gay rights umbrella and equating their condition with that of homosexual men.

    Transgenders are the complete opposite of gay men. They run away from the gay.

  55. candideinnc says

    I am an older man, in my late 60s. I have had very limited exposure to trans people–only had one acquaintance in graduate school. Then again, I didn’t come out until my 40s, and didn’t have close relations with gays until then, either. While I may be uncomfortable with some people who may seem unusual to me such as transsexuals, though, I recognize that the discomfort is my problem, and something that I need to deal with. It is NOT a matter of superiority.

    Equal legal rights for transsexuals is a matter of fairness, not comfort. If we demand justice of our government for gay people, we must recognize the need to demand justice for trans people, for all races, for women. We cannot pick and choose, like this man Ruse does, which people we think deserve equality.

  56. Randy says

    The only thing that embarrasses me as a gay man is the eagerness with which we’ll throw pretty much any other group (including some of our own) under the bus if they actually demand equality and freedom for all, and recognize that conservative gay marriage is not the only civil rights issue of our day.

  57. Thedrdonna says

    Jim Bryant: I am trans. I have transitioned, and am a woman. I am also solely attracted to women, as are about 1/3 of all trans women. Another third are bisexual. So this theory that trans women transition in order to live out their attractions to men in a socially-acceptable way is harebrained and ignorant of the reality.

  58. Vera says

    @candidinnc
    You summed it up right there! I may not feel comfortable or agree with the concept of transgenderism and the intellectualization behind it, but in a free society you don’t need a reason to give people rights, you need a reason to take them away. People forget that, all the time. Transgender people did nothing wrong, we can sort out what the concept is, what it means for our society and what we wish to do about it later. Just let people be people for now…

  59. Beth says

    Vera, you can support trans rights, but that doesn’t justify altering gay and lesbian identity and saying that they are in a single community with a lot of straight people who crossdress. It is extremely homophobic and disrespectful to gays and lesbians to do that.

    Support trans rights? Sure, no problem. Same way I support immigration rights and a right to health care and a bunch of other issues. But don’t change my name, my identity and tell me that I am now joined at the hip to transgenders and have an obligation to put everything second to their demands.

  60. Beth says

    “If we demand justice of our government for gay people, we must recognize the need to demand justice for trans people, for all races, for women. We cannot pick and choose”

    Um, OK. But then why is there only a T added to LGB? There would need to be letters for all races, for women, for every social, ethnic, racial, and religious group in the world. Otherwise, you are picking and choosing T above all others.

    Of course, what you really mean is that LGBs should be allies with Ts on certain issues. And that is not controversial. What is controversial is the notion that we have to relabel LGBs so that their identity is forever linked with an amorphous group (which is itself many different sub-groups) of mostly heterosexual people, ranging from hermaphrodites to crossdressers to transsexuals to people with diagnosable gender dysphorias and disorders and that we are morally forbidden from pursuing gay civil rights unless whatever goal we are pursuing explicitly includes these straight people with gender issues.

    That is an attack on lesbian and gay people. It has directly harmed lesbian and gay people. I will oppose it.

  61. Thedrdonna says

    @Beth: there are very few people in the trans community or the LGBT community who believe that transvestites form a significant group that requires advocacy. Most of the trans-centric advocacy revolves around gender nonconforming and transsexual peoples, who live their day-to-day lives outside of their assigned-at-birth gender. To claim that the vast majority of trans folks who require advocacy are straight transvestites is wrong, and misleading.

  62. says

    @Beth, you’re mistaken that trans-rights advocacy mostly benefits heterosexual people. How is equal rights for trans people an attack on lesbian and gay people? Surely you don’t think equal rights for gays and lesbians is an attack on trans people?

    Laws that protect on the basis of gender presentation and identity benefit many LGB people who fall outside what are considered by the narrow-minded mainstream gender norms–a lot of the bullying and discrimination of LGB people is based on gender as much or more than sexuality alone. This has always been true.

    Trans-supportive people and laws do not harm LGB people–on the contrary. Nearly all people who are transphobic are also homophobic–It’s hard to imagine any trans allies who aren’t also gay-friendly. All states with strong trans protections also have strong protections and tolerance thresholds for gays and lesbians (some of whom are also transgender).

  63. jimbryant says

    Ernie,

    You’re mixing so many identities, you’ve formed an identity soup that doesn’t mean anything.

    I know that you like the idea of a coalition but sometimes you’ve just got to give up.

  64. Beth says

    @Ernie:

    Trans rights are not an attack on LGBs. As I said, I support trans rights. LGBT is an attack on LGB identity and has harmed LGBs and Ts. Supporting trans people and trans rights is not the same thing as supporting LGBT.

    @TheDrDonna:

    Every time a gay civil rights bill is opposed because it does not include a provision relating to “gender expression” that is an example of gay civil rights being thwarted because of an ideological decree that prioritizes crossdressers (the vast majority of whom are straight) over gays, lesbians and bisexuals. And under the ideology of LGBT, it isn’t enough that gay people have to support straight crossdresser rights. It isn’t even enough that LGBs actively spend their limited time and money on behalf of straight crossdresser rights. No, LGBT tells us that we have to actively oppose our own civil rights unless straight crossdresser rights are included in the specific legislation under consideration. Even supporting gender expression in a separate bill is unacceptable even if it means everyone loses. It is crazy and destructive and we should all revisit exactly how we got here, IMHO.

  65. charlie says

    I’m a gay man and I never once wanted the transexuals to join our group. They didn’t have enough numbers of their own so they invaded our groups. Where I live they have destroyed several gay groups. And I’m in a very liberal area. Its got nothing to do with hate. My suggestion was for them to join the straight women’s groups.

  66. JackieSD says

    So a gay man is an invader in his own community?!! To hell with you and your disgusting trans thugs. You exploit us and take advantage of us and we arent taking it any more!

  67. says

    @Beth: There has never been a prioritization of straight “crossdressers,” nor have LGB people been asked to or have in reality spent money and time championing straight “crossdresser” rights. Your bizarre repetition of the term “straight crossdressers,” as if that’s what the T in LGBT is all about, is curious. Why do straight crossdressers fascinate so? “Gender expression” provisions in bills, on the other hand, benefit LGB and T people.

    @Jim: I’m not mixing identities. Life does that, always has. You and Charlie should look at our history.

  68. Fenrox says

    @Beth, the T wasn’t added! IT WAS ALWAYS THERE YOU FOOL. AGAIN, TO YOU PEOPLE INCAPABLE OF LEARNING HISTORY: THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A GAY MOVEMENT THAT WAS NOT ALSO SUPPORTED BY TRANSGENDER PEOPLE, THEY HAVE ALWAYS AND IN EVERY WAY BEEN IN OUR COMMUNITY.

  69. Fenrox says

    Ok, this is enough, we need to get andy to stop helping these terrible people. These comments need ratings and a better system of management. Andy has known this for a long time and refuses to address it, we need to start petitioning and boycotting this site. The laughable idea that a gay rights and interest site harbors anti-gay bigots is a sad reality here.

  70. says

    Concur, Fenrox. I’m a fan of Disqus.

    Andy, get on it! Change the format and this site’s two hateful trolls, and their many aliases, will all but disappear from your site. Thoughtful debate will remain, pathetic trolling will be gone. Hop to it.

  71. Thedrdonna says

    Jackie, yes, presumably Charlie is gay. However, he’s also an incoherent transphobe who has decided that “his” community shouldn’t include trans folk, much like you, and those people are the invaders of the gender and sexual minorities. So, kindly, piss off.

  72. Meggie says

    Ruse and his sidekick, Anthony Esolen, are repressed social misfits with little better to do than obsess over other people’s sex lives. How sad. I don’t know what bizarre narcissism makes them think they have the right to dictate to others what they should believe. They’re both an embarrassment to religious movements everywhere. For anyone who thinks these two losers reflect Catholic thinking of belief … meet Pope Francis!:-)

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