1. Mike says

    Does Marlett have a website for political donations yet? I just watched this, and it sounds like she’s MOST afraid of “the homosexuals” exercising their democratic right to finance her opponent.

    In fact, I can’t wait to donate money.

  2. TOOBOOT says

    How embarrassing for Oklahoma. This nation has had its fill of unenlightened and ignorant Republicans. Whenever these so called Christians who normalize violence through their “love the sinner hate the sin” rhetoric, rears their ugliness, the extreme nature of their thinking is exposed. Its a slow, arduous process. I’m so proud of Mr. Jones ability to present his case devoid of the emotions I would have had, namely to reach across the table and throttle Sally.

  3. Voet says

    In his recent book, Frank Schaeffer says that the religious right is being led by three kinds of people, “The dumb or idealistic ones who really believed. The out-and-out charlatans. And the smart ones who still believed – sort of – but knew that the evangelical world was sh*t, but who couldn’t figure out any way to earn as good a living anywhere else.”

    Peggy Kern seems like the first type.

  4. PBashline says

    As a gay man living in Oklahoma City, I was impressed with Rev. Jones. He showed great compassion, knowledge, and showed restraint. Sitting next to Rep Sally Kern was former OKC Mayor Kirk Humprheys who, while Mayor of OKC, banned our gay pride banners from being displayed on city light poles that line city city streets. OKC’s GLBT organizations, mainly Cimarron Alliance Group, sued the city and won the lawsuit. Mayor Humphreys is one of the most homophobic people, besides Kern, I have ever had the displeasure of meeting.

    Rev Jones did a great job…I will be lending my support to Martlett in whatever capacity he needs…Kern must be defeated at all costs!

  5. question all says

    The bible should never be used as a legislative tool. If the “laws” in the bible are so important how is it that only two of the ten commandments are civil laws, stealing and killing.

    Stop using the bible to divide us. The fastest growing religious affiliation in this country is “none”. Hopefully as this group continues to grow politicians like this well no longer be elected.

  6. Andy says

    I agree with Tooboot. Sally Kern may be round the bend, but she put forth her argument in a way that no doubt resonates with other Christianists. For Rev. Jones to respond by saying, “well, that’s too ridiculous to merit a response,” gets us nowhere. I also think trying to argue that the bible’s anti-gay statements can be explained away by translation issues is a red herring. Far better to admit the obvious but then note that people who believe the bible is unerring have a lot more explaining to do than gays. What gives them the right to edit the bible, which they constantly do? Where is their anti-divorce amendment to the constitution? It’s fine for Kern to have anti-gay views or even belong to an anti-gay church, but there is a little something called separation of church and state that makes her status as an elected official problematic in the extreme – this was not even brought up. Why do we constantly let these people dictate the terms of the argument? I hope Marlett has some media savvy.

  7. mike says

    Amen, BMAC! It’s gonna take a pair and then some to finally shut these low-life fundies down. I would have reached across that table and just pinched her little lips shut, yes I would!

  8. Brad says

    I think Mrs. Kern and her cohort monopolize this whole conversation. They kept interjecting specific Christian dogma and biblical scripture into everything. It devolved into a theological debate which is not where it should have been. I also feel that while he was given short shrift in the whole conversation, he also did not bring up some important points he ought to have. The moderator was clearly biased. Oh well, at least it’s being discussed somewhat. Thank God I don’t live in Oklahoma!

  9. peterparker says

    Religious scholars have stated that the translation of the Bible is flawed and that the passages that currently mention homosexuality were, in the original language, NOT referring to homosexuality. 1 Timothy 1:9-10 uses a word, ‘arsenkoitai’ which has been translated as ‘homosexual’. Religious scholars contend that ‘arsenokoitai’ actually meant ‘pimps, prostitutes, boy sex slaves, abusive pedophiles or male prostitutes’, but did NOT refer to two men in a loving relationship. I wish Pastor Jones had brought up this fact to Representative Kern.

  10. Bobby says

    That woman is an idiot. She needs to be stopped spreading her hatred.
    The country is not ran by “the bible” and it should never be.
    Let her believe as she wishes, just don’t expect everyone else to follow along.

    Karma is gonna bite that bitch hard.

  11. bd1421 says

    What bothers me is that when she thought that only a select, obviously right-wing Christian audience was listening, Ms Kern outright lambasted the gay community and accused them of an insane agenda and the fall of every society that embraced them JUST to stir up support for herself. Yet, when put face to face with a gay man, she qualified every accusation to say that she is only against “the sin of homosexuality” – not Rev Jones or anyone in particular…

    BULLSHIT! What a COWARDLY response to being caught red-handed in hate speech! She outright attacked a segment of AMERICANS (and yes, even OKLAHOMANS – her own constituency) and she needs to own up to that.

    I also agree that the argument over semantics gets us nowhere. What changes people is the humanness of the situation – friends and family members coming out to their fundamentalist parents, brothers, sisters, neighbors and friends. Through their personal stories of misery under the condemnation fundamentalist Christians bring versus the relief of being accepted for who you are, bigoted hearts are slowly melted.

    Additionally, allow me to rant a little and say that I am TIRED of being the bastard of the American family reunion in most political arenas. Thank GOD (or whoever you believe in) that the movement in this country is changing, little by little, to tolerance. Thank GOD that assholes like Sally Kern are becoming the minority in this world. Thank GOD that soon, enough people will be supportive of the LGBT community that politicians won’t be able to USE us anymore! And thank GOD that hatred like hers is being called out for what it is.

  12. Derrick from Philly says

    This woman is represents the part of America that Reverend Jeremiah Wright was preaching about. Years ago, it was race relations, now it’s the “homosexual agenda”. I think they used to warn the country about Jews too. Hell, they even preached against the Roman Catholics. Reverend Wright was right about racist bigoted Americans like that shrew in the Oklahoma legislature.

  13. johnny says

    The idiocy of saying that God’s O.T. moral or ceremonial laws should still be followed makes it OK to do several things that are against the laws of the U.S. currently.

    I wish the man would have shown several examples of how insane her line of thinking is. Once you show someone’s picking and choosing O.T. law – while leaving out several laws that aren’t followed now – for their OWN AGENDA, you can make some headway in this arguement. At least with people that don’t have their head firmly shoved up their ass.

    What’s really interesting is that she actually believes her wild imaginative future play-out will come true: a country run by gays if things keep going our way with our agenda in place. If only.

    Would someone PLEASE fax me a copy of our agenda??? I missed the last meeting.

  14. says

    Did you miss your own Easter church service this year? Well, by clicking on this link ( you can make up for that loss by listening to Oklahoma’s Rep. Sally Kern, district 84, give her own Sunday sermon.

    This March 23 local program on Oklahoma City’s channel 4, KFOR, was billed as a debate between Rep. Sally Kern and Dr. Rev. Scott Jones of Cathedral of Hope in Oklahoma City. But thanks to the connivance of moderator-in-name-only Kevin Ogle, Kern was allowed to control the conversation by talking over and louder than anyone else at the table.

    Her “discussion” in the form of a monologue centered on, what else, her bible’s version of what is or is not sinful and the usual steam-tray of cafeteria-style pick-and-choose bible verses.

    Until the issue of LGBT equality moves beyond dueling bible verses and slinging death-ray one liners about who has the superior scholarship, there will be little progress made in obtaining under civil law the rights and benefits for which LGBT citizens are paying taxes.

    I’m not interested in blocking anyone’s free speech opportunities, whether that be in the public square or the private sanctuary. But I am VERY interested in getting what is due to me and my LGBT friends which is full recognition of the birthright of living in this country–free and open access to all federal, state, and local benefits, rights, and privileges, without questioning our sexual orientation or gender presentation, bar none.

    To go back into the closet is unthinkable and would return the playing field to those who are alarmed that we LGBT people are running for public office, participating in the democratic process, and winning elections both local and statewide all across the country.

    The 2003 Lawrence v. Texas decision was our Declaration of Independence–our private lives can no longer be used to intimidate us with threats of public exposure, arrest, and monetary fines.

    With Lawrence we regained our humanity and self-esteem but there are many people who would deny the validity of the Supreme Court.

    We must understand that those who oppose our full participation in the country’s social network do not care for our equality; they’ve never learned to share, they don’t play by the same rules. I think we’re not absorbing this fact into our strategies.

    We must act persistently, always legally, and at the same time, forcefully in the public courts, the public square, and our social circles to demand that our citizenship is recognized as an integral part of our country’s past, present, and future.

  15. Jerry in RI says

    First thing that comes to my mind…THANK GOD I was born in New England! Our Congressmen / Congresswomen would be run out of town for making comments like Sally’s.

    Second…Andy I think it would be great if you could post Ron Marlett’s website if / when you find it. I, and many others no doubt, would be more than happy to take part in the democratic process in Oklahoma…or should I have said fund the “homosexual agenda” in Oklahoma?? Which is it? I’m confused.

  16. Zeke says

    I was bothered that Sister Sally was able to repeat “homosexual agenda” and “homosexual lifestyle” about thirty times each with out being challenged EVEN ONCE to explain what those terms mean.

    Nor was she asked to cite her sources for all of her misinformation.

    I thought the Pastor giving the counter argument was weak, ill prepared and poorly articulated.

  17. says

    Though the gay Pastor made some nice points, he mostly wasted the opportunity. Would that he were better versed in how to respond to such silly though powerful people like Kern. I’m disappointed that he somehow believes that using alternative biblical interpretations is a winning approach when challenging bigots. He was given a public platform to spread the message that gay people are in fact fully human and to refute the weak arguments used against us; he failed miserably.

    Here’s what the Pastor ought to have said and what you ought to say when confronting one of the advocates of the anti-gay fundamentalist religious industry:

    (looking at Kerns)

    Let me make this very clear: homosexuals are natural normal whole beautiful positive contributing law-abiding citizens. We love fully and our families are fully loved. That’s the truth. Period. End of subject.

    But for your sake, just this once, I’ll go on:

    Some texts in the Bible are ignorant and barbaric, surely reflecting the ancient times in which they were written. Think stoning, slavery, divorce, and yes homosexuality. No fair minded intelligent person would disagree with me on that. If you disagree Ms. Kern, as I’m sure you do, you are simply a hypocrite.

    Furthermore, by promoting the idea that gay people are inherently inferior Ms. Kern, you madam are a supremacist. And like many supremacists, you wish to segregate, dehumanize, vilify and scapegoat those you deem of lesser status. Your descendants will assuredly be ashamed of you.

    Ms. Kern, how can I say this more plainly: your hateful words have encouraged the gay bashers out there; your hateful words have given them more power. I hope that one day you will understand the great injustice and the great slander you’ve perpetrated against millions upon millions of fellow citizens and that you will sincerely repent. I wish that for you personally with all of my heart.

    (looks into the camera)

    I ask all fair minded compassionate Oklahomans to reject the bigoted irrational supremacist views of Ms. Kern and people like her, not for my sake but for the sake of your gay family members, friends, coworkers, fellow parishioners and neighbors. Isn’t it time we say no, once and for all, to those who ask you to believe that anti-gay bigotry is OK if it’s sourced in the Bible? Isn’t it time we all stood together against all forms of religiously inspired hate?

    I ask all fair minded compassionate Oklahomans to accept what is obvious, that gay people are whole beautiful positive variations of life and that equality is our birthright from time immemorial just as it is yours. Won’t you help us in our efforts to correct the exclusionary practices of the past?

    We truly need your help, especially when up against the misguided views of people like Sally Kerns and the religious fundamentalist anti-gay industries which support them.

    I, for one, will no longer participate in any debate which focuses on my worth as a gay human being.

    (turns to Kern)

    Ms. Kern, homosexuality is not a sin nor a sickness. That’s the truth. And you can change your bigoted supremacist views. That’s also the truth. Good luck, think about all that I’ve said, and be well.

    (turns to the moderator)

    The debate is over.

  18. says

    kern really is talking christian culture. culture involves a human code of behavior, for the benefit of humans. the teachings of christ are about spirit. if our american indian neighbors had been loved as one loves oneself there would not been a genecide.As to those bisexual online like . They show different ideas about it.

  19. Clyde says

    I am deeply disappoited that Pastor Jones did not challenge Representative Kern more. He was just too nice to this bigoted, narrow-minded, hateful — and downright stupid — individual. She took over the “conversation.” I was “fed-up” with the pastor early on, when he allowed her to get away with denying that homosexuals are born that way and that homosexuality is not a “choice.” She even denied that all the major medical and psychiatric associations have said that homosexuality is a natural (or God-given, if you will) characteristic — neither a “sickness” nor a “choice.” This woman needs nothing less that a full-scale public humilation from someone with both knowledge and “balls”!

    As a gay Christian, I am always fascinated — or, I should say, appalled — when these so-called homophobic “Christians” NEVER cite Gospel passages of what Jesus said. They always quote either Saint Paul or the Torah; they never quote Jesus — yet they call themselves “Christians.” I am a Christian because of the Life and Message of Jesus Christ — not because of the Laws of the Torah (which ultimately led to the crucifixion of Christ) or the opinions of Saint Paul in his Epistles. As a Christian, the Loving Jesus is the focus of my life — not the Torah; not the Epistles; and not the modern-day “Bible Thumpers” and their message of hate. Nowhere in the Gospels does Jesus Christ condemn me. “Yes, Jesus loves me!”

  20. Derrick from Philly says

    Hey, Tom:

    I’m not the only one who “injects race” (compares racism to anti-gay hatred) in the threads being discussed on this blog. You just don’t like it when certain Towleroad visitors do it. I wonder why, Tom?

    When evil shrews like her were talking about race, and the dangers of race mixing–it was ok for you, hunh, Tom? Now, that she’s promoting the hatred of gay men, you can see how unfair it is. Maybe you agreed with her back when the issue was stopping the “Civil Rights Agenda” (well, your kind agreed with her).

    Yes, it was American bigots like Kern that Reverend Wright was ranting about in his condemnation of American hypocrisy; but obviously, some white gay men are so embedded in that same bigotry that they can’t see it. They can’t see the relation between racial hatred and the hatred of gay people espoused by Sally Kern and her kind. Can you see it, Tom?

  21. Ike says

    While I applaud Rev Jones’ effort, it was a missed opportunity to state homosexuality is not a choice, is not a life style, it is a genetically determined gift from God. Rev Jones would have made more of an impact had he stated scriptural responses to those interjected during the discussion. Many of these may be found at:
    Additionally, gay men and women have every right to run for political office to ‘right the wrongs’ by the religious right and conservatives, who have their own discriminatory agendas, many of which are against taxpaying, hardworking, family oriented gay Americans. Sally Kern has her own agenda to destroy the lives of millions of Americans.

  22. Zeke says

    DERRICK, pay TOM no mind.

    Strange how a valid comparison between racism and homophobia is considered to be an injection of race whereas outrageously racist comments made in discussions about homophobia are ignored by TOM and many others here, especially those of the GayPatriot brigade.

  23. QueenZafrona says

    Seems like the people on this show and some of the people here forgot the Bible also says “Judge not, lest ye be judged.” When Jesus came to the earth he told that he replaced the ten commandments. There is a reason that the “Old” Testament is old. It was replaced by Jesus Christ and his commandments were : to love thy neighbour as thyself, and to love your lord God with all your heart, mind and strength. If everyone did that, then there would be no need to judge whether homosexuality is a sin. It is God’s love that needs to be shared, not the hatred of the right wingers.

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