Comments

  1. jeffrey Christman says

    That segment was so powerful… how wonderful for that positive and beautiful understanding, support and love for those who are born gay. Never before have I heard something so clear and touching. Thank you Oprah, Rev. Bacon and Rev. Beckwith for being beacons of light :)

  2. says

    Re: the Christofascists on the Oprah board … I’ve never seen so many nutjobs quoting Levicital Law. How many of these batsh*t crazy @$$#0!es live their daily lives according to every rule listed in the Book of Leviticus. These people are deranged …

  3. crispy says

    Hello, Mr. Warren, I have the Rev. Bacon on the line. He has something he’d like to talk to you about.

  4. says

    Re: the commenters on Oprah board who can’t stop quoting Levitical Law. Have they read that book? And do they live their daily lives according to every tenet of the Book of Leviticus? Hm, didn’t think so.

  5. Rhea says

    I don’t understand why so many anti-gay conservative Christians would be outraged/surprised at this….it was on Oprah for cryin’ out loud….not exactly a beacon of conservative Christian beliefs, you know?

  6. Anonymous says

    Of course, being born gay is a gift from God. It’s part of who I am and I wouldn’t change it for anything in the world.

  7. Brendan says

    Wow, it’s so powerful and refreshing to be hearing all this from a reverend. I couldn’t make myself click the link to the Oprah forums, though. I don’t want my day ruined.

  8. gordo says

    I made the mistake of clicking through. I guess it’s a human nature to define “the other” and find reasons they are inferior. Certainly the christian churches are built on it.

    If I believed in a supernatural god I would thank it for making me gay.

  9. Jay says

    Considering that she was Obama’s most visible supporter during the campaign, this Oprah moment is a nice bit of contrast…

  10. Zeke says

    In a perfect world Rev. Bacon and All Saints Church would be considered FUNDAMENTAList Christians and the Warrens, Robertsons, Falwells, Dobsons and Phelpses of the world would be considered the heretics.

    It seems that the majority of “Christians'” perception on this is exactly backwards though I’m pretty sure that the Christ recorded in the gospels would see it this way.

  11. says

    Leviticus runs into trouble with the Christianists when it commands that heterosexual adulterers should be stoned to death. (Leviticus 20:10)

    The God Boterers are not to down with that command, obviously.

    The Bible commands the death penalty for anyone who works on Sunday (Exodus 31 verse 15) oops, Walmart, oops Target.

  12. David says

    You know what isn’t a gift from God? Christians disguising their bigotry as scriptural mandate.

    And on another note, if I read anything that starts with “I don’t judge but my lord does” or “love the sinner, hate the sin” one more time, I will have a psychotic episode or an aneurysm. Whichever comes first.

  13. MAJeff says

    **In a perfect world Rev. Bacon and All Saints Church would be considered FUNDAMENTAList Christians and the Warrens, Robertsons, Falwells, Dobsons and Phelpses of the world would be considered the heretics.**

    In a perfect world they’d all be recognized as fantasists.

  14. Derrick from Philly says

    “Leviticus runs into trouble with the Christianists when it commands that heterosexual adulterers should be stoned to death. (Leviticus 20:10)”

    Amen, FASTLAND:

    but they ask for forgiveness every Sunday morning, and then go out and fornicate and adulterate every next Saturday night. Hetero adulterers got made, baby!

    I wouldn’t mind stonin’ some adulterers and fornicators though–you know, to follow the Good Book and keep the Faith. Amen.

  15. Richard says

    You know, I just don’t understand how people can quote the bible and think it is fact or proof of what they are saying. Perhaps they are all of an older generation. I’m 24, and I just don’t get people who are bible thumpers.

    I grew up going to a Catholic high school and had to go to religion class (although I’ve always thought the bible and the whole Jesus thing was just a myth like the Greek gods), so I consider myself fairly educated on Christianity. These people are twisting the quotations around, following only selections of the bible literally, and look uneducated and stupid. Haven’t we progressed past the Middle Ages?

    Anyway, my point and questions is this: Are the people posting on Oprah’s board of an older generation? I’ve lived in several places (though mostly in New Orleans, and no one is very normal there- young or ancient- LOL).

    I’ve never really experienced anyone being super mean to me because I am gay . Sure there have been little instances of hate directed towards me because I am gay, but they are usually retaliating to something I’ve said to them.

    Maybe I haven’t encountered all these weirdos because I don’t hang out with the 60+ crowd? I think when some of the older generation dies out from old age, some of the hatred towards gays will go also.

    The evangelical movement/cult in America is growing though, so who knows.

    Great, now I’ve written a poorly edited novel here. Sorry folks ;-P

  16. Ben says

    I saw that yesterday and almost fell off the treadmill.

    Awesome. On some level, it’s how I’ve felt but never really articulated. As I’ve told my “christian” relatives many times – I’m willing to have God judge me are you?

  17. Matt says

    Being gay is a lot of things, including a choice I made a long time ago and that I keep on making, all the time. It’s one of the best decisions I ever made.

    It is not a gift from God any more than those chocolates I got this year were a gift from Santa.

  18. Derrick from Philly says

    “…someone needs to go on there and quote about how black people are the lowest race on the totem pole, and cursed by God and that their slavery is OK in His eyes.”

    Ahhh…the election of 2008 was made especially for garbage like you.

    Kiss your new president’s beautiful brown ass, you size-challenged peckerwood.

    Bless you.

  19. Louis says

    Hello, Mr. Obama, I have the Rev. Bacon on the line. He has something he’d like to talk to you about.

  20. nic says

    MATT,

    you are nothing if not consistent. time and again you prove yourself to be superficial. when do you think you might un-choose to be gay? i will spring for the send-off party. or what if we uncerimoniously throw you off a cliff?

  21. Rhea says

    @Richard:

    Consider yourself lucky then. As a 25 year old gay Christian I’ve gotten more crap over my sexuality from those under 40 than any other group.

  22. Rob says

    I wish people would evolve already and throw off the chains of diety worship. If everyone rose above the misguided and misdirected teachings of their respective religions and focused on the betterment of all, the world would be a far better place.

  23. Mike in the Tundra says

    Actually I did force myself to read Leviticus. I think it should be subtitled “Everything You Wanted to Know About Burnt Sacrifices, but Were Afraid to Ask.” It is not at all relative to today’s culture.

    I actutally feel that all sexuality is a gift from God. It’s just that God put more thought into my gift and didn’t give me one that’s so common as heterosexuality.

  24. TikiHead says

    Homosexuality is not a gift from God — it’s a rental. The first 30 years are free, then the payments start. You signed the lease before you were born.

  25. JerzeeMike says

    The definition of the word Christian is to be Christ-like and follow his teachings. Jesus himself stated that he was the fulfillment of God’s covenant to the people of Israel and that he was sent by God for all the people of the world. The New Testament is what Christians should be following as it is God’s new covenant for all the people.

    As I recall, Jesus did not address homosexuality explicitly but asks us to treat our neighbors as we wish to be treated and to not judge others lest we be judged. A real Christian follows our Lord’s example and knows that gays are God’s children as much as anyone else. The message Rev. Bacon delivers is one I hope I emulate when I give sermon to my fellows. God loves all his children, please remember that above all else.

    Rev. JerzeeMike

  26. Jay says

    @Tikihead: Aw crap! I threw those bills out when they started showing up cause I thought they were junk mail. What’s their collections procedure like?

  27. TikiHead says

    “What’s their collections procedure like?”

    Vicious! There’s no shutoff notice, you just wake up one day and no longer like Madonna, Kathy Griffin or American Idol.

  28. TANK says

    I’ll take Francis over this smug snake oil selling doucheburst any day of the week. At least he could paint.

  29. Jay says

    Wow! Alright, Tiki – I’m convinced. I’ll pay my bill and any late charges. Idol starts too soon for me to lose the gene now!

  30. Aiden Raccoon says

    “I don’t judge but my LORD does”.

    For the people who say this:

    Fine, looks like I’ll just have to wait for that to come when I die and I’ll happily burn in hell than to live in a heaven where God doesn’t want me. So if you really believe that then you should be making life here on Earth as comfortable as possible for us for the short time we can be here. I’ve been more inclined to believe in God because of Christians who want marriage for us and would be happy to join in your religious crusade if you would just stay out of our bedrooms.

    Also the bible says NOTHING about lesbians so why do you still oppose that? What bible reference do you place that on?

  31. Zeke says

    Actually AIDEN, the homobigot Paul did address girl on girl action.

    Romans 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

    But who cares what this misogynistic, slavery supporting, homophobic closet case had to say? He was about as Christ-like as Jerry Falwell.

  32. Joe Allan says

    Thank you, Red Seven. I can’t take this bullshit Christian right-wing garbage any more. These people are no more Christian than a Nazi skinhead. There is nothing Christ-like in what they say or in their behavior. Christianity has been hijacked. Forget the fact that Christ warned about idiots like these using his name to further their own hateful, biased agenda. Frankly, all of this has forced me to take a good hard look at religion as being nothing more than myth and mind control. I’ve so over all of it.

  33. Ted says

    Agree with so many of the comments. One thing I’d like to know, maybe I missed it. Where has Oprah been on the gay rights issue? She has more money than God so she can afford to take a stand. It’s great that she invites people of various backgrounds on the show to illustrate a diversity of viewpoints to her audience, but it would be so much more effective for her Bible-toting fans if she was to come out explicitly for LGBT rights. She could be doing us so much good. Is she against LGBT rights?

  34. FedUp says

    To say that being gay is a gift from God.

    Is a slap to God’s face, given that there are several scriptures in the bible that states it is detestable act. For a clergy to make such a blasphemous comment, he must be on drugs. We all will be held accountable for our actions (good, bad, moral, or immoral) on the day of judgement.

    Therefore, if one wants to live in contrary to God’s principles then he/she will have to answer for their lifestyle.

  35. rudy says

    Fedup, For your opinions to have any credibility, one would have to believe in an idiotic diety. God is not stupid, but you are.

    I do not have a “lifestyle;” rather, I am gay because that is the way God made me, in his image. Yes, we will all be held accountable; therefore, if you act on your stupidity and bigotry, you will be rightly condemned. It is your ‘judgement’ [sic] that is flawed not God’s.

    Now go away stupid little troll. This blog is for adults who are capable of thought. You fail on both criteria.

  36. 1♥ says

    @ Fedup
    Your proslavery Bible is a “slap to God’s face”.

    My Bible is the Thomas Jefferson Bible where Jesus is a just a simple man that simply wants us to love one another.

    Of course that’s something that you will never understand.

  37. TylerAnthony says

    What is read in the Levitical Code is dealing with Male Temple Prostitution.

    The Levitical code is cerimonial.

    In the levitical code swine/pig is considered an unclean animal-ceremonially. Man took it further and made the pig a morally-physically-spiritually unclean animal. In the beginning of creation God said that it was good. and to Peter in a vision he told Peter to kill and eat things that in the Levitical code were off limits. And then told Peter “Don’t call unclean what I have made clean”

    There is also a section that talks about a woman lying down before a beast. That is dealing with sexual or spiritual submission to an animal made into a god. Bulls Pigs and certian other animals were common ‘gods’ to the surrounding people of the Hebrews. Aaron the high priest made a golden bull at the demand of the people and they worshipped it and had sex beneath it.

    Sodomites were male temple prostitutes. Which is why people will associate oral/anal sex with Sodomy.

    That verse in Leviticus is not dealing with same sex attraction.

  38. FedUp says

    Rudy & 1love,

    Your “lifestyle” [sic], are yours’. However, there is no present day Bible that condone your lifestyle. And for a so-call man of god (clergy) to say it’s a gift, makes me wonder which god is he serving.

    As stated before it is not my place to judge, however if you can show me in the Bible where this is acceptable or is a gift then I will adjust my paradigm.

  39. 1♥ says

    @Fedup
    I don’t accept your proslavery bible as the “word of God”. Your proslavery bible also includes many stories (start with Genesis) that are complete works of fiction. Like 600 year old Noah building a boat and living another 350 years after the supposed flood. And if Genesis isn’t true that would mean the bible is in error from the start and can not be trusted.

    My Bible, the one that founding father Thomas Jefferson wrote, doesn’t condemn me for being Gay. That’s because Jesus never condemned anybody for being Gay. It’s quite obvious that Jesus didn’t care if people where Gay or not. But Jesus did care that we all learn to love one another.

    My being Gay is most certainly a gift from God because I’ve learned not to believe in the lies of your proslavery bible but to believe what is in my heart.

  40. TANK says

    You never win a religious dispute with reference to the bible to back ya up. All you really end up proving is that it’s internally inconsistent, viz., meaningless. But it doesn’t discredit it for some strange reason. Faith as a mental illness…

  41. FedUp says

    @ 1love
    You need to study your Bible. Given that the Bible was inspired by God (2Tim 3:16). You are correct the the Bible is proslavery, since it was written over a 1600 year period (1513 BCE through 98 AD) and published in more than 2300 languages. It is the only book that provides detail info for the past, present, and future.
    NOTE:- If the Old Testament books are not good for you. Then here are some New Testament scriptures for your reading (2Cor 6:9-10 & 1Tim 1:10).

    I hope that you will have the instential fortitude to examine these verses.

  42. TANK says

    That alone should give you pause to refer to it as god’s word, fedup. There’s no way to know who wrote the bible, in fact…it’s been rewritten over and over again. Ya know, there’s no good reason to believe that Jesus even existed as an historical figure…

    I do hope you have the intestinal fortitude to read the book of a primitive death cult that quite literally worships death, not life; and at every turn emphasizes death over life. Read the irrational ravings of a cult is in no position to criticize any other religion on rational grounds that employ the use of evidence. Pastafarianism is just so much more fun, too–but just as plausible as christianity.

  43. Anonymous says

    You can say all this about Christians not living their lives exactly to the Levitical law, but do they claim it to be a gift from God to sin? I didn’t think so. To say to sin, being gay, is a gift from God is absurd and ridiculous.

  44. TANK says

    To believe something for which you have no evidence is absurd and ridiculous. That is, to be a christian is ridiculous…and it seems immoral as I answer to a higher power than the one that condemns homosexuality. Adult ethics.

  45. TANK says

    The needless suffering of one thing capable of suffering is enough to cancel out the existence of the christian god.

  46. Anonymous says

    To say that we have no evidence of God is absurd and ridiculous. Where do you think we came from? Where do you think all of nature came from? I don’t care how you think of it, something had to start it all. There is no way that Spontaneous Generation just happened all over the earth. THAT’S absurd.

  47. TANK says

    Anon, you are clearly without education…a dissembler who’s never heard of the big bang or evolution? There is simply no evidence for a creator or host of them (team god) or pasta monster or the christian god. Pointing to “nature” (and honestly, the christian understanding of nature excludes nature. There’s nothing natural about christian “natural law”) doesn’t equate to evidence for god anymore than tapping your foot is evidence for an earthquake.

  48. MAJeff says

    Wheeeeeee, anonymous is not only anti-gay, but a creationist to boot. We’ve got a live loon!

  49. Anon. says

    OK, let’s see, who put everything here? I’m not talking about us, or the so called unimportant nature argument, but how about who put everything here for the big bang? Even if the big bang is true, someone had to put everything there. There had to be a beginning at some point. How bout it? What started the universe, the galaxies?

  50. I am your Mother says

    There you have it. Even after all these years of education and outreach, etc., even with whatever degree of tolerance (as distinct from acceptance) we may have achieved, there is this strong belief that while we gays may (somehow) be human or something, we cannot ‘partake of the divinity’ that is at the core of heterosexual folks. And by extension their divinely-designed sexual and romantic couplings. This is why people are having kiniptions about gay marriage even when they aren’t that bothered anti-discrimination protections. It’s the fact they believe their hetero-sexual attraction to each other is divinely given and that it is the only type of sexual attraction that is divinely given. Yes, being gay is a gift from god. As is being heterosexual, bisexual, polysexual, etc. Jesus (or the biblical texts) may not have said ‘being gay is a gift from god’ but he certainly didn’t say it isn’t. In fact he said nothing about being gay. And if you accept the idea that god made man in ‘his’ image, then yes, god intended some people to be gay – not everybody, but some people.

    It’s also very weird to read people who claim they are christians running and quoting leviticus, because jesus said (or at least the biblical books that claim to record what jesus said) that he came to do away with the mosaic laws and replace them with a higher standard, i.e.: love your god with all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself. Period. So what people who claim they are christian are running around and quoting leviticus is puzzling, unless they are really jewish and don’t know it.

  51. Anonymous says

    For one thing, just because God made us in his image does not mean that we always do what he wants us to do. Then, in 1 Corinthians 6:9, Paul says “Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor HOMOSEXUAL OFFENDERS….” That’s in the New Testament, after Jesus came.

  52. 1♥ says

    @Fed up
    I see you don’t have an explanation for the error’s (read lies) in your bible. I only started with Geneses but there is much more, and I am quite familiar with both the old and New Testament.
    Like these New Testament verses:
    Titus 2:9
    Teach slaves to be subject to their masters in everything, to try to please them, not to talk back to them,
    1 Peter 2:18
    Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh.

    Obviously you don’t have the “instential (is that intestinal) fortitude” to read the Thomas Jefferson Bible.
    @ANON: read some science books particularly ones about M theory
    @ANONYMOUS & Fedup
    Again allow me to state that I don’t accept your proslavery bible as the “word of God”. Your quote from proslavery Paul is meaningless. Paul’s hatred for me is just as meaningless to me as the hatred Pat Robertson’s and the two of you have for me. The two of you can continue to use your Bible of lies to justify your bigotry but we Gays are not the lesser children of God.

  53. SandiLaughs says

    I am THRILLED at Rev. Bacon’s statement although I’m straight, 59 yrs. old and Christian. You see, I have a mind that thinks and I also read things besides the bible. Please don’t think that you need to wait for all the “old folks” to die off before gays receive LOVE & PEACE from the masses. There are plenty of children being taught the ways of hatred in the fundamental churches throughout the country. Hopefully people like Oprah & Rev. Bacon will continue to enlighten people one (or one million) at a time. The gay community (and their gay supporters such as myself – via emails, conversations, and bumperstickers) will hopefully also have an impact. LOVE is what will make a difference. LOVE, new laws for marriage between gays & lesbians, and interaction with those who just don’t understand.

    I do get it. I know it’s not a choice. I wish all gay & lesbian couples JOY and now understand what Rev. Bacon meant. I pray that the world will come to understand in your lifetime!

  54. TANK says

    Well, anonymous, I don’t have to discredit you. I can just let you continue to post… It should embarrass you, but doesn’t. Where the big bang came from? 1. That’s like asking what’s north of the north pole, and 2., there is NO evidence for a “creator” of any kind–even in speculation. The “look around you” argument merely assumes that there was a creator…and who created the creator if everything needs to be created, and the creator’s creator, etc, etc, etc? In fact, it could have been different laws of physics that persisted before the big bang (minus entropy, for example), such that it could have existed infinitely. That is actually more plausible (because it’s coherent) than skygod and the logical contradictions and physical impossibilities that rise from that claptrap mythology. At least quantum loop gravity…oh, for christ’s sake, I’m talking to a person who just learned his alphabet.

    The bible is full of logical inconsistencies. In fact, the very definition of the abrahamic god (3-O world creator) is subject to logical contradiction such that it does not exist. It is expected given the number of human writers and rewriters it has had throughout the centuries…unremarkably and predictbly, this does not reflect the mind of a perfectly knowledgeable all powerful creator speaking through these contributors…but the minds of humans beset by insecurities, hostilities, desires, etc like any other. It is certainly not “inerrant,” and can be demonstrated to be so.

    Any book that sanctions slavery or bigotry, stoning humans for doing things like wear two different kinds of fabric, and discrimination of any kind (including homophobia and sexism) is one that quite literally endorses needless suffering and is evil. Any person that looks to such a book for guidance and wisdom needs to find a new god and a new book.

    Unfortunately, most of the religious don’t read or think or do anything but start from religion–as anonymous does by assuming the truth of the bible–and end at the very same place. That’s how the meme spreads by supressing critical scrutiny of it and encouraging a leap of blind, unquestioning adherence. There is no defense of such sloppy and unethical thinking. It’s barely reasoning.

    Further, no one would suggest it’s all bad such that a religious person has never done the right thing; merely that their religion had nothing to do with them doing the right thing–and the right action could have been performed without religion….and this is demonstrable. Its harm greatly outweighs its benefit, and it’s time for the primitive desert moralities of death cults and war tribes to go away.

    And this vapid, brainless douchebag bacon whatever is guilty of spreading the meme of christianity, as is pat robertson.

  55. upset in texas says

    Rev. Bacon you horrible, sick, pathetic ignorant man. How dare you pronounce that being gay is a gift from god, im suprised god himself did not severly punish you for those inflamatory, satinistic words. I am sure that if you ask god for forgiviness he will spare you what you truly deserve— eternal damnation in hell along with all the other gay sinners.

  56. upset in texas says

    Rev. Bacon you horrible, sick, pathetic ignorant man. How dare you pronounce that being gay is a gift from god, im suprised god himself did not severly punish you for those inflamatory, satinistic words. I am sure that if you ask god for forgiviness he will spare you what you truly deserve— eternal damnation in hell along with all the other gay sinners.

  57. MAJeff says

    The fun thing about upsetbigot is that they probably think their nasty deity is actually a “loving god.”

  58. MAJeff says

    Really, Al? I thought eyesight, as a biological function, ended at death. So, no, we won’t all see. In the end, we’ll all end up dead and decompose….and eventually our planet will likely be destroyed by our sun’s explosion or a massive meteor collision or some other big ol’ cataclysm. Shit happens.

  59. MAJeff says

    Have nothing? I have a wonderful life. Great friends. A lot of people who care about me and whom I care about. I have a joy in good food, good music, and good conversation. Sometimes, I have really rocking sex. I have a wonderful job as a teacher.

    Why would I want to devote my life to a silly fairy tale. There’s a life to be lived in the miniscule time I have on this planet, and I intend to LIVE it. I’m not about to waste it talking to myself while deluded into thinking some vile uber-sadist is listening to me.

  60. To each his own says

    Your life and talents you may possess are gifts from God. The choices you make in life are just that, CHOICES. God gave us all free will and the ability to choose. When you choose your sexual preference you’ve made a choice, not received a gift. God loves every thing He created, but our choices may not please Him, but His love never changes. No different than Mom & Dad, they loves us always, but may not like the things we choose to do.

  61. TANK says

    “When you choose your sexual preference”

    This is hate baiting. And there’s no argument being offered. Just bare assertion after bare assertion. You’re telling a story that’s not supported by science, actually. It’s worse than a story because it’s bullshit. You don’t care about the truth, just what makes you feel comfortable–or what you want to be the case, which isn’t.

    You really don’t expect, after the antievolution unintelligent design garbage, that “homosexuality is a choice” is now relevant, do you? What compels a unthinking person such as yourself to continue to post? Boredom, or the intentions that pave the road to hell?

    And in light of serious criticism, you and the others have shown that you simply have nothing to respond with. You can’t handle them. One can only conclude that you either don’t understand them or think inconsistently…that is, don’t think…no offense intended…

  62. To each his own says

    No offense taken.
    What makes someone homo or heterosexual? Their choice of a sexual partner, right? So it happens to be a choice. A person may be intimate with whomever they CHOOSE to be, it is a personal decision. Whether it be male, female, white, black, fat, skinny….it’s all a choice. When one becomes seduced by the spirit of homosexuality….they then make choices to pursue that lifestyle. Truth is…. God made man and woman. Woman with an opening to receive man. Man with an opening to defecate. Truth. Even an unthinking person such as myself understands that.

  63. Samuel Jones says

    I would like to reply to all the people who still look at the Levitical Laws for guidance. The main reason they are in the Holy Bible is to show people that God’s promise was fufilled. In the Book of Matt. 5:17 Christ states that he came to fufill not abolish the Law of Moses. There are plenty of things we as humans mis-interpretate in the Bible. Jesus Christ never said stone anyone. As a matter of fact, In the Book of John 8:7 He challenged anyone who has never committed a sin to throw the first stone at the woman who committed adultery. God’s promise has been fulfilled. Levitical Laws were needed back then because Jesus hadn’t come to die for our sins yet. I siad our because he did not come only for those who believes in him but also those who dont. He did not only come to save the able-bodied but also the hadicapped. He did not only come to save the heterosexuals but also the homosexuals.

    I don’t agree with homosexuals being special people from God. I do believe they should not be disciminated against. In the Book of 1Cor. 6:9 it states that homosexuals will not inherit the Kingdom of God. This means homosexuals are being condemned by God. I never saw the passage where it said hate homosexuals. Any human being that condemns a homosexual is a fool.

  64. l. says

    You all are so blinded by this man who calls himself a Reverend man of God.He is just leading you into a devils hell.Read Romans chapter 1 verses 18-32(KJV) it tells how women amd men changed their ways.God made Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve.Homosexuality is abomination.Jesus does FORGIVE and SAVE if you will you will truly believe on him as your personal SAVIOR.

  65. 1♥ says

    @ L.
    Oh L., you poor dear. You’re so blinded by your hate filled proslavery bible with it’s god of a 6,000 year old earth that you can’t even understand the simple concept of a love.

  66. Sherry says

    The Oprah show has gone to the dogs. I can’t believe this man is on her show saying that being gay is a gift from God. This man is sick!!!

  67. TANK says

    Alright, fuds, you can’t get an OUGHT from an IS. I have this ugly lamp, ya see. It works spectacularly as an umbrella stand! It is a lamp, yet given that, should it be a lamp? Of course not… SO the moral is that just because something is a given way in no way means it should be that way (domestic violence rates are high in the u.s….well, ya know…I don’t think it should be that way). Things that are that cause no harm are ethically permissable…like any sexual orientation.

    Assuming that it’s true that a designer exists to design things, then god also designed the ebola virus, malaria, cholera, and birth defects. God designed these things, and needn’t have. SO clearly you worship some kind of evil psychopath…crazy with power who enjoys torturing his creation. That implies that it doesn’t exist…given its definition.

    Lastly, there’s nothing inconsistent with free will and god creating a world in which everyone were a breeder. If it were so bad to god as per god’s pronouncement, why didn’t he do that? He could’ve…he was aware of it… I think that implies that god doesn’t exist OR that, in fact, there’s nothing wrong with homosexuality according to your god, who also happens to be a crazy psychopath drunk with power.

  68. Mike says

    When will Jesus freaks fucking realize that WE DON’T GIVE A SHIT about what their fucking skydaddy has to say about ANYTHING?!? It’s akin to a Muslim saying to a Jesus freak, “…but Allah said…,” or a Buddhist saying “…but Buddah said….” “And?” the Jesus freak would reply, finding whatever was said by Allah or Buddah to be completely irrelevant to their lives. It’s the SAME THING! The Bible has no more affect on my life than a single ant being crushed under my shoe.

  69. Snowed in Ohio says

    Why are these evangelical people posting on a gay site in the first place? Let’s face it…religion (just about any religion) has turned on us gay males so most gay males become agnostic, atheists or indifferent. While I believe in a great force that connects all of us, I certainly don’t believe we have a “Parent” or “Dad” in the sky, sitting on a throne with a white beard who gives us free will then punishes us for choices we make–and our sexuality is not a choice.

    These Bible quoters simply choose to live by the word (a word that from book-to-book contradicts itself) and not be free thinking individuals. No amount of pointing this out is ever going to change them or their thinking. They don’t care about the FACT that their Good Book has been re-written, changed and warped to and for the benefit of a few throughout history. They don’t see all the admonishments against heterosexuals. (Far more than anything that could be considered homophobic) They simply fail to understand the heritage of their religion. Moreover they FAIL to understand the Bible in the CONTEXT of TIME, CULTURE and HISTORY. They actually believe the ‘stories’ and absolute truth ONLY because it was the way they were raised and taught. Furthermore, they are taught to NEVER be critical of that thinking. If they stepped out of the shadow of Religion and researched they truly would be enlightened.

    Man’s spiritually has greatly failed to keep up with our technical and scientific understanding of the world around us. Look at these GAY IS BAD posters! Until such a time that our spirituality (not our religions) catches up, we are all doomed to stay separated.

  70. halima says

    The old testament revealed that God in his wisdom destroyed the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, Jesus didnt come to change what has been before like he said and you and i cannot say that God was making a mistake by destroying these people because of their homosexual practices which is unfortunately overruled here by Rev. Ed Bacon, by believing you seem to know more than God. Its a pitty that by the time you find out the truth it will be too late to undo this grave error you are making as a Man of God(Rev. Ed Bacon). Oprah, please there is more to this life than pleasing a growing minority,pleasing God is key;for only then will people be pleased with you. God never approved of this act and there is no where in the Bible that states that he did.
    People only twist things but i know deep down in their minds they know the truth. Opposite attracts, that has always been reality and it will forever be even in science. You all should be warned, if you cant stop homosexuality like God did with the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorrah, then dont promote it under the umbrella of religion.Please don’t.

  71. halima says

    Snowed in Ohio, read the Holy Quran and i bet you will never find any contradictions therein but only the truth if you dare to know the truth. This also goes to all the truth seekers; clearity on the issue of Homosexuality as religion is concerned is open for you.

  72. Snowed in Ohio says

    Halima. Clearly you are one of those people that can’t go beyond your religious up-bringing. You are attempting to read the Bible literally. The ‘story’ of Sodom and Gomorrah had NOTHING to do gays. If you believe your God to be an all knowing, all seeing, perfect creator then how can you say he created something ‘bad’ or ‘perverted’? What kind of sick entity creates something in his/her image–giving them free will and when they ‘choose’ (quotes because I do not think it is a choice like Peas or Carrots) to be gay says…Ah…WRONG. Repent or go to hell. Do not pass GO and do not collect My Love. Why do you people continue to create a god in OUR image? One that is a Fatherly figure…one that punishes us…one that is petty and jealous? Does that sound “Godly” to you? Does that sound Enlightened to you? What, is God just like us, only better vantage point and kick-ass super powers? Give me a break.

    As for the Quran it is no better (or worse) than the Bible. Islam is just as bad as Christianity or for that matter, any intolerant, hateful religion that teaches only a special few that follow THEIR laws are the good people. Everyone else–baaaad.

  73. TANK says

    “No amount of pointing this out is ever going to change them or their thinking.”

    Ah huh. One correction. Thinking is an inappropriate term to characterize their output. Reference to the bible and other holy books is an excuse not to think. These people are like vegetables in that way.

    Anyway…

    Reasoning with the irrational is not possible, as demonstrated by the mindless robots who repeat themselves ad nauseam on THIS, of all comments sections…on this of all blogs. None of these islamochristotards are going to respond to the problems of evil in any way taken seriously, .e.g, they parrot freewill like that somehow addresses it when it so clearly does not. None are going to respond intelligently to the charge of irrationality on their part for not according beliefs to evidence–for not having ANY good reason to believe in their most cherished religious fables.

    I like the suggestion of teaching the world’s religions to small children as part of a cultural competency instructional. They can learn all of the different faiths at a young age so that they can ultimately see for themselves that they have no reason to believe one or the other or any when it comes to religion.

  74. TANK says

    No contradictions in the quran? LMAO! The quran is as vile a piece of work (if not more vile) as the bible. It instructs all manner of madness and is responsible for the needless death and suffering of countless many…Islam is a religion of despotism and war, and people need backbone beyond the effete pluralistic liberal tolerance and acknowledge it for precisely what it is.

    “What can be said of the nuclear brinksmanship between India and Pakistan if their divergent religious beliefs are to be “respected”? There is nothing for religious pluralists to criticize but each country’s poor diplomacy–while, in truth, the entire conflict is born of an irrational embrace of myth. Over one million people died in the orgy of religious killing that attended the partitioning of India and Pakistan. The two countries have since fought three official wars, suffered a continuous blood letting” at their shared border, and are now poised to exterminate one another with nuclear weapons simply because they disagree of about “facts” that are every bit as fanciful as the names of Santa’s reindeer. And their discourse is such that they are capable of mustering a suicidal level of enthusiasm for these subjects without evidence. Their conflict is only nominally about land, because their incompatible claims upon the territory of Kashmir are a direct consequence of their religious differences. Indeed, the only reason India and Pakistan are different countries is that the beliefs of Islam cannot be reconciled with those of Hinduism. From the point of view of Islam, it would be scarcely possible to conceive a way of scandalizing Allah that is not perpetrated, each morning, by some observant Hindu. The “land” these people are actually fighting over is not to be found in this world. When will we realize that the concessions we have made to faith in our political discourse have prevented us from even speaking about, much less uprooting, the most prolific source of violence in our history?

    Mothers were skewered on swords as their children watched. Young women were stripped and raped in broad daylight, then…set on fire. A pregnant woman’s belly was slit open, her fetus raised skyward on the tip of sword and then tossed onto one of the fires that blazed across the city.

    This is not an account of the Middle Ages, nor is it a tale from Middle Earth. This is our world. The cause of this behavior was not economic, it was not racial, and it was not political. The above passge describes the violence that erupted between Hindus and Muslims in India in the winter of 2002. The only difference between these groups consists in what they believe about God. Over one thousand people died in this monthlong series of riots–nearly half as many as have died in the Isreali-Palestinian conflict in more than a decade. And these are tiny numbers, considering the possibilities. A nuclear war between India and Pakistan seems almost inevitable, given what most Indians and Pakastanis believe about the afterlife.”

    -Sam Harris, The End of Faith: Religion, Terror and the Future of Reason, p. 26-27

  75. Snowed in Ohio says

    Tank; That sounds like a great book…was the entire post from the Harris book? Little by Little, one person at a time perhaps books like the one you quoted and others will awaken people to the stupidity of these old religions–these “My God is Better than Your God” type arguments. What type of “God” makes Man his foot solider? “Tell ya what, little human. You kill in my name those who don’t believe and me, and I will give you this sweet deal…” HA! If there was a god, he’d be fighting his own battle. The truth is, the only “battle” is the one Man creates.

  76. halima says

    Snowed in Ohio, are you telling me that because God Almighty created us all and some people decided to become rapists, serial killers, terrorists etc that they are justified as you are – making choices that you can’t admit? if you don’t know everyone of us have been given free will to either do good, making the right choices or bad – the consequences definately follow, which i’m sure you don’t have the knowledge to comprehend.Now are you telling me these other group of people didn’t have a choice and so the society should let them be and say oh they are special creations from God. Please give me a break, clearly you are so ignorant and don’t tell me you know anything about Islam or the Quran for i’m 110% sure you have never read it.
    Now you tell me what exactly happened in Sodom and Gomorrah? I’ll like to know since you claim to know something new the rest of us are oblivious to.

  77. halima says

    I’m pretty sure Rev. Ed Bacon will soon say being a serial killer, a rapist, a terrorist et’al is a gift from his god that we don’t know exists.
    Dear Rev. if you want to promote homosexuality, no one is stoping you but do that under the umbrella of other than Religion. For you seriously need deliverance and guidance.

  78. halima says

    I’m pretty sure Rev. Ed Bacon will soon say being a serial killer, a rapist, a terrorist et’al is a gift from his god that we don’t know exists.
    Dear Rev. if you want to promote homosexuality, no one is stoping you but do that under the umbrella of other than Religion. For you seriously need deliverance and guidance.

  79. says

    “I’m pretty sure Rev. Ed Bacon will soon say being a serial killer, a rapist, a terrorist et’al is a gift from his god that we don’t know exists.”

    Please alert us as soon as Rev. Bacon makes this pronouncement. We’ll be holding our collective gay breaths.

    I can never quite understand why religious people don’t worry about their own relationship with God instead of worrying about everyone else’s relationship with God. And did God instruct you to be unnaturally obsessed with homosexuality? I’d wait for your answer, but I just have so much sodomizing, raping, serial killing, and bomb making to attend to!

  80. TANK says

    Yeah, snowed, it’s a good book. Sam Harris is definitely worth acquainting yourself with, especially when confronted by pluralistic apologists like Reza Aslan.

    Thank you for proving my point, halima, that your faith is an excuse not to think by comparing homosexuality to serial killing and rape. You are a fool and an unethical bigot if you can’t see the difference between activities that cause harm and suffering and activities that do not. How does one even confront such unabashed bigotry, ignorance and clear stupidity? One doesn’t. Continue to read your evil book, and shut your mind off to ethics. The quran is littered with the most repugnant commands conceivable, and islamic states carry them out and subsequently have some of the worst human rights records in history. One does not reason or even attempt to with someone who is a islamic fundamentalist…

    Once again, they chant “freewill” mindlessly without comprehending and thinking through what they say. I’ve got science and ETHICS on my side and you’ve got superstition and hatred. Go to hell.

  81. halima says

    Tank, clearly you are one of those people that say things you dont know, that the Quran is vile! i bet you have never opened a page of the Quran to read and i dare you to grab a copy and read cover to cover and tell me if you find any contradiction or any where in the Quran where violence or war was instigated.
    India and Pakistani war and similar wars are definately highly political,there is no where in the Quran where violence, killing of innocent people is permitted. So if people that claim to be muslims but don’t follow the tenats of the religion acts and people like you generalize it as being the face of the religion, then you are narrow minded for they clearly don’t represent Islam as a religion.
    Islam has always been the religion of peace and it will forever be, so recognize when it is being practised for a true muslim is compassionate, patient, humble and will never take the right of another man, for justice is key and will never fight execpt when he or she is protecting him/herself against oppressors.
    You gays can go ahead and be who ever you want to be, i personally dont have a problem with that for we all have the free will to choose what and who we want to be without escaping the consequences in the end but PLEASE, PLEASE AND PLEASE expunge religion as a supporting factor like Rev. Ed. Bacon did, thats all.
    And Tank don’t pick on issues you have no knowledge about – Islam for one, you should always research before making such statements.

  82. says

    Ah these fundies… They claim the Bible is the infallible word of God, but then they for some reason think he wrote it all down in English for them to understand. Unless they know Hebrew and NT Greek they’re just talking out of their (what Jesus rode in on).

    There is not one reference to a homosexual anywhere in the Bible because that term was not invented until 1869. Any time that word appears in a translation of the Bible it is an insertion by a translator with an agenda. And the fundies buy it hook line and sinker. Critical thinking not being their strong suit…

    2 things I really hate about fundies. They’re intellectually lazy. And they think they have the right to tell other people how to live.

  83. says

    Oh, and Halima: You’re the one who should do a little research.

    Sodom and Gomorrah / homosexuality? Check it out with actual scholars of the Old Testament.

  84. TANK says

    “Tank, clearly you are one of those people that say things you dont know,”

    NO, this isn’t about knowing the particulars of a story book, though I could, on command, give you an extensive list of EVIL passages from the quran. This won’t turn into a scary quoteoff, you unthinking bigot.

    “that the Quran is vile!”

    And it is.

    “i bet you have never opened a page of the Quran to read and i dare you to grab a copy and read cover to cover and tell me if you find any contradiction or any where in the Quran where violence or war was instigated.”

    Aw, what the hell, you idiot.

    Don’t bother to warn the disbelievers. Allah has blinded them. Theirs will be an awful doom. (2:6)

    A fire has been prepared for disbelievers, whose fuel is men and stone. (2:24)

    Jews are the greediest of all humankind. They’d like to live 1000 years, but they are going to hell (2:96)

    Kill disbelievers wherever you find them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.(But if they desist in their unbelief, don’t kill them). 2:191-192

    War is ordained by Allah, and all Muslims must be willing to fight, whether they like it or not. 2:216

    And the list goes on and on and on. Yeah, the quran’s a real winner…LMAO! As to scientific, logical, and factual consistencies, the quran is just as replete with them as the bible.

    “India and Pakistani war and similar wars are definately highly political,”

    That’s because for you, the religious is indistinguishable from the political.

    “there is no where in the Quran where violence, killing of innocent people is permitted.”

    That’s an absolute lie and is so easily proven such that it’s not even funny. Don’t lie and call others ignorant when you not only refuse to THINK, but simply want to bullshit.

  85. halima says

    Clearly you guys are a lost cause for if you don’t believe in religion what are you doing on this site? Go to hell! – Tank do you believe in hell? if you do then we are sure getting somewhere…….lol
    I keep saying your knowledge is limited, Homosexuality, raping, stealing , telling lies,killing are all bad acts forbidden by God that does not exempt the fact that it will all be forgiven by total repentance. We are to stay clear of it, even animals pick there partners correctly(the opposite sex), clearly they are more intelligent than you guys.
    God is a patient God that is why you all have the grace to live in this world as if it will never end and as if you are lord and master of all your affair, this is a grave error.
    And Ernie there is no attachment or affinity with your kind for me other than you guys should not mix it with religion like the Rev. did which brought about all this in the first place, remember that is where all this started from.
    Tank, address the Islam thing after reading the Quran, if you dont do this then you should not be talking about it for you know zero in this context.

  86. halima says

    Tank all these quotes are out of context,read the foot notes and tafsirs to understand why and when these statements were made and as regards what, oh you possess such infinitesimal amount of understanding.
    But all hope is not lost for you and people like you, that i know.

  87. TANK says

    We’re a lost cause because we don’t embrace your tyrannical bigotry founded upon superstition and blind adherence to a primitive religion of war? Oh, okay. You dare compare homosexuality to rape and stealing when your religion (far more a choice than homosexuality, which is not) is implicated in mass murders throughout the globe? If anything needs to go, and go now, it’s Islam, not homosexuality given that it actually causes HARM.

    You are simply without the capacity to think on your own at this point. You cry for context and capitalize on liberal tolerance while demanding absolute obeyance to your fairy tale faith. Anyone who does not agree with it is maligned, compared to a killer or a thief, and told that they simply don’t understand or are being “bigoted”. Christotards do this, too. It’s how memes like christianity and islam are preserved; their own built in defense mechanisms. But we understand all TOO WELL, actually. We understand that in Iran, it is permissable and required to beat women for failing to cover their faces in public! We understand all too well that homosexuality is punished by death in primitive islamic theocracies! We understand that there is NO EXCUSE for this that you can possibly conceive of, and that you are a delusional and unethical for suggesting otherwise.

    There’s no confusion here, and no reading of the quran (which I have) will magically turn islam into a religion of peace which it MOST CERTAINLY IS NOT.

  88. says

    “And Ernie there is no attachment or affinity with your kind for me other than you guys should not mix it with religion like the Rev. did which brought about all this in the first place, remember that is where all this started from.”

    We’re free to “mix it with religion” however we like. The Rev. has a different personal relationship with God than you do, why do you care? Your personal interpretation of what we “should” do is of no importance. I’m still not clear why, if you have no “attachment or affinity” with homosexuality, you’re spending so much of your time commenting on a 100% gay website?

  89. 1♥ says

    Thank you Tank, that post was absolutely correct.

    @ Halima,
    All Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam) are entirely reliant on the notions of prophesy and revelation (i.e. that the creator of the universe relayed “special messages” to certain ancient individuals). Your religion, as well as the other two, have NO proof what so ever that God has revealed any messages that allow you to judge others or to dictate to them how their religion should be practiced. Abraham, Lot, and Moses never existed and you have absolutely no proof that they ever existed. Therefore your god of Abraham is a lie and your religion is a lie. Your religion does nothing more than whore the name of God to fill its lust for power. The followers of your religion for all around the world danced in celebration because they murdered thousands of innocent people on 9/11/01. Your god of Abraham religion relishes in the blood, violence and death of the innocent. There is no amount of twisted logic you have that can deny that fact.

  90. Snowed in Ohio says

    Halima–Okay, you just claimed Tank took the Quran quotes OUT OF CONTEXT. Gee, couldn’t the same be said for those that read the Bible and think God is against homosexuals? For that matter, there are those that would look at those quotes and interrupt them LITERALLY–regardless of footnotes, astrix and whatever other exception you care to place on it. Again people take either holy book out of CONTEXT all the time. They have used it, re-written it and held it as an example to oppress, kill and destroy all kinds of people. You are doing it right now and don’t even realize it.

    You NEVER answered my questions either. Which seems more “Godly” behavior? Behaving like Man? Wouldn’t the truly “Godly” entity rise above Man’s stupidity, ego, and hatred? Do you believe YOUR religion is the only path to ‘salvation’?

    Um and what are YOU doing on a 100% gay owned, operated and read blog?! You have less reason to be here than those you are trying to ‘convert’.

  91. Anonymous says

    OK, so although I’ve been out of this for a couple of days, I do have a few words. For the text out of the Bible, it may be taken out of context, but it is what it is. Taking it out of context, at least the stuff I’ve posted on here, means the same as in context, old and new testament. As for the Quran, I’ll be the first to admit, I’ve never read it, so I don’t know anything about it, except that it has been the supposed cause for much violence. But has the Bible ever been known to promote violence?

  92. Samuel Jones says

    I would like to reply to all the people who still look at the Levitical Laws for guidance or to critize the Holy Bible. The main reason they are in the Holy Bible is to show people that God’s promise was fufilled. In the Book of Matt. 5:17 Christ states that he came to fufill not abolish the Law of Moses. There are plenty of things we as humans mis-interpretate in the Bible. Jesus Christ never said stone anyone. As a matter of fact, In the Book of John 8:7 He challenged anyone who has never committed a sin to throw the first stone at the woman who committed adultery. God’s promise has been fulfilled. Levitical Laws were needed back then because Jesus hadn’t come to die for our sins yet. I said our because he did not come only for those who believes in him but also those who dont. He did not only come to save the able-bodied but also the hadicapped. He did not only come to save the heterosexuals but also the homosexuals.

  93. Tara says

    I was so impressedby this man.Thnk you to Oprah for having him on and to all the “christians” for showing their true colors! I made a mistake in my comment about Al Sharpton.I thought he was for prop 8 and I sorry to anybody I rubbed the wrong way.Pardon the pun.Don’t worry somebody sraightened my out on it.I’m still not a fan but glad he doesn’t promote 8.

  94. MAJeff says

    “Jesus came to die for our sins.”

    You’ve done something so awful that another human being needed to be murdered? You consider that an equitable exchange? Your “loving god” created a person by impregnating a young girl–who had no choice in the matter–specifically to kill that person. And, we need to revel in that murder because it keeps us from being totured for all eternity for violating some arbitrary rules.

    And all of that is good?!

    I’ve never done something so awful that I would consider the murder of another human being an equitable exchange. Y’all folks reveling in that story and glorifying it must be some real evil and sick bastards.

  95. Tara says

    Sherry, you are a christan, right?Keep your negative comments to yourself and the hateful kids you are probably raising.It’s sad to have people like you around.

  96. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Majeff. I never typed the phrase: “Jesus came to die for our sins.” I ask that you to not put things I did not type in quotations. I believe you are saying these things because you think Abrahamic religions has turned on gays. You think homosexuals shouldn’t worship or believe in God. I know there alot homophobes in this world. I also know it has alot to do with religion. The sad thing about most Christians is that they do not know the Bible never said hate homosexuals but still that is what they think it’s in there. God loves everyone.

    “You’ve done something so awful that another human being needed to be murdered?” Who are you talking to? The ones who brought sin into this world were Adam and Eve(No reference to the Adam and Steve insult). If you want to challenge a religion or a religious text, study it like Tank did to prove your point. God Himself came down in the form of a man. This proves He is loving. I don’t know why you are focusing on Christ’s murder. You should focus on His teachings if you want to challenge Christianity. Evil?!! You don’t know what evil is. Evil is when someone has to suffer for being different. That is evil.

  97. MAJeff says

    I think no one should worship a figment of the imagination, particularly a genocidal monster that advocates slavery and misogyny, that creates a specific space of eternal torture for violating arbitrary rules it also created, rapes a young girl to produce a child that must eventually be murdered, condemns those who don’t acknowledge and accept that murder as a condition for them not being eternally tortured themselves…..It’s a pretty vile monster you worship.

  98. Snowed in Ohio says

    Those that are on here and quoting the Bible and typing what they believe their Christian God to think, feel, require and demand miss the point of the segment. They are talking NOT of ANY particular religion or religious book.(and the US, that would primarily be Christianity) they are talking SPIRITUALITY. Big difference. It goes beyond the twisted, or misrepresented teachings in which people tend to get wrapped up. As long as people continue to think that their book, their religion, their god is the only true and valid way to salvation, ever-lasting life or greater connectivity, we will continue to kill, vilify, segregate, hate, distrust, preach against and otherwise separate ourselves. Wow. Now doesn’t THAT sound like a god (or more correctly, a religion) we should all get behind? See ourselves as part of a collective whole and the world will change.

  99. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Majeff. When did Christ ever advocate slavery and misogyny? Why haven’t you said anything that backs up your challenge? Try to do what Tank did. He studied a portion of the Quran and shut that Homophobic retard Halima up. Try to prove me wrong. When has Jesus ever said that he will condemn those who don’t acknowledge and accept his so-called ‘murder’? Why do you insist that God raped Mary? The ‘child’ you speak of was the incarnation of God.

  100. Lee says

    Samuel Jones: I have read all of your posts and I have come to some conclusions.

    1. You are not gay. I wonder why you are on this site. My guess is that you saw the Oprah Show and wanted to discuss it.

    2. You are one of those heterosexuals who tolerate gays. You are preaching about tolerance but I think you are wasting your time. I applaud you for being a real Christian and living by Christ’s words and not like those airheaded bastards who quote the Bible blindly. I said your were wasting your time because there are not alot of people like you in this world.

    3. You feel strongly about Christianity. You have said alot of things that I wanted to debate but couldn’t because your posts seem so well-written and thought out. I myself do not have a religion because there is too much debate over who’s religion is right. That God fella, I had my doubts about his exsistence but I now think He exsists. Snowed in Ohio’s last post explains how I really feel about religion.

  101. TANK says

    I’ve been referred on more than one occasion here by someone I couldn’t disagree with more. Scary bible quote time.

    “When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. When the Lord your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. . . . This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby.”

    “However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you.”

    “I also gave them over to statutes that were not good and laws they could not live by; I let them become defiled through their gifts—the sacrifice of every firstborn—that I might fill them with horror so they would know that I am the LORD.”

    “If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.”

    “Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every authority instituted among men.
    2:18 Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh.”

    “Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property.”

    Mathematical error…

    “He made the Sea of cast metal, circular in shape, measuring ten cubits from rim to rim . . . It took a line of thirty cubits to measure around it.”

    pi apparently equals 3 in the bible…and the world is flat…

    Now how about Jesus…and all the wonderful things Jesus said.

    “Many of you think that I have come to establish peace in the physical realm. I will not bring peace, but dissension, fire, sword, and war. Families will be divided because of me; friends will stop associating with one another, nations will join in battle. Yes, those who would follow me must be willing to forsake everything, and to stand alone, if they would inherit the realm of my Parents.”

    Sounds like a real peace loving hippy…garbage in, garbage out.

    Why would anyone but their trust in such a flawed book? Look to it for guidance even? Don’t you folks think? Do you ever stop and think?

    And should bad and false beliefs be RESPECTED? I know this guy who believes that cats are evil…and his belief COMMANDS respect in virtue of him having it… He doesn’t have any good reason to suggest that cats are evil, but we should legislate his beliefs and ban cats…really, it commands our respect.

  102. TANK says

    And really, no ill will intended; that’s just my style…and I love it. Like a hot cup of coffee to the crotch ;), with sensitivity toward none. I don’t ease people out of their cherished fairytale because they subscibe to them as a result of the shock and awe that attends them (and let’s drop the pretense…it’s not about love–people don’t worship love anymore than they do gravity…it’s about the bells and whistles and miracles)…and I’m all about shock and awe.

    But it infuriates me…this justification of false beliefs helps those that do harmful things with them. Religious moderates of just about every stripe and flavor have blood on their hands!

  103. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Tank. You have not said anything that is credible for challenging Christianity. I don’t think you have read all my posts. You speak of the Bible, I speak of Christ. If you read my other post you will understand that phrase. You have incorrectly quoted Jesus Christ. I ask that you to not put things that were said in quotations. No one has yet to challenge Christianity. People have challenged the Bible but they challenge the promise. You say the Holy Bible is flawed. Christians live by the words of Christ. I thought you knew that.

  104. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Lee. I do not think I am wasting my time. I believe there are other Christian heterosexuals that feel the same way I do.

    I do feel strongly about Christianity. Listen Lee, Like I typed in my other posts the main reason Levitical Laws are in the Holy Bible is to show people that God’s promise was fufilled. In the Book of Matt. 5:17 Christ states that he came to fufill not abolish the Law of Moses. There are plenty of things we as humans mis-interpretate in the Bible. The Holy Bible is structured in a way that We can see how things were done before Christ and we should do things now. That is why you see guys like Tank trying to make it seem like things that were before Christ is what Christianity stands for when that is clearly not the case. No one has challenged Christianity the right way, yet and I’m starting to think no one will.

  105. Michael says

    You’re an idiot Samuel Jones. I can’t believe there are straight homophilic Christians. You are preaching tolerance when it is so clear that gays were not meant to be liked or tolerated. You’re what I would like to call a homo-lover. If you don’t stop now then you will become gay and that’s not a good thing. Why don’t you listen to the gay guy, Lee and stop before you get something like HIV.

  106. TANK says

    That’s dogma, samuel. When you said I haven’t said anything to discredit the bible and christianity, you yourself haven’t said ANYTHING in defense of the bible or christianity, or jesus…not one argument provided…there’s no good reason to believe that jesus even existed as an historical figure, either–and many to the contrary. I haven’t taken jesus’s words out of context. He said he’s here to bring pain and suffering upon the land until people believe what he wants them to. Jesus Christ is said to mention hell more than anything else…he threatens non-believers with eternal damnation. That doesn’t sound like a loving messiah or an ethically person who’s willing to stoop to base threats to facilitate belief in his divinity…LMAO!

    “If ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.” [“John viii, 24.]

    “Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels … And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.” [Matt xxv, 31-46.]

    Further, christ’s words and only christ’as words aren’t Christianity. No christian believes JUST what what christ said, considering he didn’t write any of it down…and the bible I and II are more than just christ’s words. So either you believe it or you don’t, but you don’t get to pick and choose the meaning of christianity.

    Of course people have challenged christianity. Very smart people throughout history have challenged christianity, and successfully. Just because you’re ignorant of these challenges and arguments doesn’t mean that they don’t exist, samuel. And you are ignorant of them, make no mistake. Further, your blind adherence to dogma prevents any rational exchange. To say “there have been no credible challenges to christianity,” is dogma…and it’s ridiculous given the facts…

    Christianity is a death cult…it is evil. And it is demonstrably false.

  107. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Michael. You are the idiot. You do not realize that you harbor hatred and evil. Turn from your ways. Read JerzeeMike’s post, then read all of my posts. Do this with an open mind and you will see the error of your ways.

  108. Samuel Jones says

    This comment is for Tank. You did not read my last comment correctly. I asked you to read all of my other posts. There you will find my defense of Christianity and Jesus Christ. The word “Christian” truely means followers of Christ and was first said when the apostles were in the City of Antioch around 98 AD. Christ words are the foundation of all Christian principles. Although He did not write any words down He his Apostles wrote down the morals, ethics, and principles Christians need to follow. Tank, I was not speaking of any challenge toward Christianity that is not on this blog. I am speaking about those who posted comments on this blog. No one on this blog has challenged Christianity the right way.

    I don’t know why you think Matt. 25:31-46 is a bad passage. I actually think it is one of the best passages the Bible has to offer. Jesus is telling His followers that if they take care of anyone in need that they will inherit the Kingdom of God. The place where you actually quoted was 41-46. He is telling these people, “Depart from Me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels…” because they did not take care of people that were in need. Jesus Christ advocated charity and philantropy and I think those are things that will make this world a better place.

  109. TANK says

    Oh, I think I have. I think that showing that Jesus resorted to terroristic threats of hellfire and damnation and schoolyard bullying if people didn’t believe what he told them to (and he did on several occasions according to those who wrote the accounts several years after his death…) is a pretty good challenge to the legitimacy of christianity. You’d think that a perfectly good god would forgive people not “believing in him”…that is, if he weren’t pathologically vain–an all too human trait, and not one I’d attribute to a worthy entity of worship.

    The first passage (John viii) I cited was specifically about belief in him. It was not about philanthropy and a refusal to help the poor, sick and those who couldn’t help themselves, but rather the christian belief that if you don’t subscribe to christ’s divinity, you’re going to hell (another problem for christians is the problem of hell)… And also, if you didn’t do as he commanded, the second one clearly suggests that one would go to hell. In light of the importance of intent behind doing something that Christ himself put on doing what he said (for the right reason–not for one’s own betterment), it is ironic that he chooses to motivate his followers with the promise of hellfire. Clearly they’re doing what he commands with that motivation for themselves, viz., to escape hell.

    I have read all of your posts, and didn’t see a defense of christianity. Instead, I encounter the arrogance of dogmatism in your empty assumption that you have the true interpretation of the bible…when clearly there is no such thing. This fact (that there is no “true” christian faith) undermines even your interpretation of the levitical laws. And further, your insistence that there haven’t been any criticisms or blah blah blah, when there have been. How about an argument instead of a bare assertion? It’d be preferred.

    Arguments against christianity predate christianity itself.

    “Either God wants to abolish evil, and cannot; or he can, but does not want to. If he wants to, but cannot, he is impotent. If he can, but does not want to, he is wicked. If God can abolish evil, and God really wants to do it, why is there evil in the world?”

    –Epicurus

    A: Because god does not exist.

    Then there’s the older euthyphro dilemma against christian “morality” formulated and advanced by Plato. Never has a christian really come up with a satisfactory response to it…

  110. Michael says

    Samuel Jones, I apologize for calling you an idiot and for mocking your “philosophy”. I read your posts along with Jerzeemike’s and I will no longer harbor hatred and evil. Well, I’ll try not to harbor hatred and evil. It is going to be difficult for me because I was raised to hate gays.

  111. Snowed in Ohio says

    MICHAEL: You were RAISED to hate gays? My parents were RAISED to hate blacks. (Hate might be strong, but the point remains) Just because you were RAISED to hate a certain segment of society does NOT make it right in the eyes of ANY All-knowing, All-Loving God. The challenge for you is to be like the Christ you profess to follow and love. Embrace those that are different from you. We are all a part of each other. Sparks to the flame? Ripples on a pond…whatever analogy you choose to use when you see yourself as part of the greater community of man then you are actually communing with the God-force. It takes an intelligent person to realize their errors, admit the errors and change course. I hope you are blessed to met a gay person or have a close friend/family member come out to you. You will find we are just like you.

  112. N Waff says

    ===========================================
    =
    = RELIGION VS. FAITH
    =
    ===========================================
    Religion is making-up a god to fit your definitions and image.

    Faith is listening to what God has already communicated, living according to God’s standards and being transformed through His power.

    The Oprah message is just another “religion” – a really nice man-made belief system having no bearing on God’s teachings.

    Jesus was the Prince of Peace and embodiment of God in flesh – able to feed thousands with nothing, heal the sick and bring the dead back to life. His message was simple; God is inviting you into His Kingdom. But people reject Him because they want religion “their way” instead of “God’s Way”

    Those people who have overcome their same-sex compulsion and restored their heterosexual nature, describe homosexuality as a compulsion, similiar to alcoholism or drug addiction. I would not consider that a DIVINE RIGHT and the Bible clearly puts it into the category of sin.

  113. 1♥ says

    @N WAFF
    You have absolutely NO proof of anything you wrote. Every word you posted was a lie. Your scriptures are a lie. Your god of the 6,000 year old earth is a lie. You have no right to force me to believe in your hateful religion or to force me to worship your false god.

  114. Snowed in Ohio says

    N WAFF. Are you serious? So if religion is making up a god, where do you get your belief in Christ raising the dead, feeding fish, etc., etc? Where do you get this information if not the Bible? Your post is ignorant. Your definition of Faith is weak and sad and evangelical. I suppose those people who you say “overcame” their same-sex attraction are probably people that took part in some sort of ex-gay therapy. (Which science has shown does not work”). Of course Ex-Gay therapy will ‘beat it’ in their heads that it is a compulsion. It fits neatly in your hate filled belief system.

  115. Lee says

    1Love: I don’t know what this N Waff guy is saying but I just can’t help to think that there is a God in heaven. At first I thought why should I believe in a being whose followers (Jews, Christians, and Muslims) ridicule and persecute me. Then I realized that there are some people like Samuel Jones, SandiLaughs, and JeezerMike that are from that part of society but aren’t afraid to strech their hands out and reach over. No matter how hard I try I just can’t help believing in God. I do know that I will never join a “religion” because there is too much debate over who’s is right and who’s is wrong. It’s has gotten so out of hand that groups are divided amongst themselves.

  116. TANK says

    Hmm. Posts such as Lee’s and other testimonials have led me to conclude that reasoned argumentation and reflecting the absurdity of religious faith to the faithful, alone, has no place in defeating toxic religion (the predominant ones on the planet). Instead, in addition to triggering environmental factors, perhaps a host of genes is responsible for such debilitating and overpowering faith in some.

    In others, however, a healthy dose of religious skepticism and encouragement of critical thinking at an early age (without pushing one agenda or another other than the commitment to reason and rationality) seems a worthwhile corrective required help those before they cannot help themselves. Dennett’s idea of multicultural religious education at an early age (all the world’s faiths preferencing none above any other), given the importance of religion and religious faith in the world…seems a good start. Pit the memes against each other to see if they cancel each other out, anyway. It’d be interesting–very interesting–to do so and isolate, in competition, the features which make them MORE successful than others.

  117. Snowed in Ohio says

    Tank. You are correct. While I was raised Lutheran (Catholic-Light as we called it) through my education (both at a Jesuit High School and college) I studied various religions. Perhaps not in depth but I was certainly introduced to them and learned the basics. In addition, I have been fortunate enough to travel widely and I have come to my conclusions (as stated in various posts above) that, in summary. We are all the same. We may look different, love different, speak different but we all want the same thing. We want to love and be loved. We want our children to be loved and love. We want to be healthy, happy and understand the world around us. We want pride. We want dignity. The things that get in the way of this? Religion and World Governments (who, like religions are only interested in their survival, not the interests of the individual.)

  118. jeffrey says

    Well here we go again. I cannot believe that you have the nerve to say that being
    gay is a gift from a Holy God. You must mean satan! Is it not enough that the world at large are being deceived by the evil one?
    And then people like you make it worst by
    spreading this trash. I’m sure that God would destroy SODOM(Y) AND GOMMORAH, and then turn around and say it’s okay to be gay. What is wrong with you people? can’t you see that God’s word doesn’t compromise on this issue nor any other SIN. It is a
    fifthy, nasty, repugnant lifestyle and I suppose that you feel it’s okay that these
    people will walk right into the waiting arms
    of a HOLY GOD after having lived a nasty lifestyle. And you, who are charged with
    teaching the TRUE word of GOD, are putting
    your own spin on this subject. Let me just say this; I can’t judge you or the people that live in the gay lifestyle, but I do know that God does not make special provisions for people that willingly practice a lifestyle that is against GOD own
    word(s). I think that you had better read the book of Romans 1:18 to the end.

  119. 1♥ says

    @Jeffrey
    You have absolutely NO proof of anything you wrote. YOU are the filthy, nasty, repugnant one. Every word in your comment was a lie. Your scriptures are a lie. Your god of the 6,000 year old earth is a lie. You have no right to force me to believe in your hateful religion or to force me to worship your false god.

  120. 1♥ says

    @LEE
    I do believe in God. But I don’t believe in the magical god of the Bible or any other scriptures. I am a deist. http://www.deism.com Just as the founding fathers Thomas Jefferson and Thomas Paine were deist. I do not and will not accept any text that is considered to be “revealed” by God. I do not and will not accept anyone using their “revealed” scriptures to judge me or others. The universe is a very complicated thing and I don’t claim to know everything about it. The same also goes for my belief in God. I don’t know what God is and I don’t have all the answers but in my search for God I know that I will not find it in a book of lies like the Bible or Quran. All I do believe in is that there is something (God) in the universe that wants us to love one another. It’s nothing anymore complicated than that. LOVE.

  121. Snowed in Ohio says

    Oh Jeffery. Spoken like a true person brainwashed to think that any “God” is a father figure, ready to punish us for our mis-deeds. Angered when we don’t follow his will (even when we are made in his image and given free will). You have been lied to, brainwashed and filled with hate. You have had your own free thinking swept away. You have had your divine right to spiritual growth and understanding muted by the Christian religion you follow without question. Besides, it certainly SOUNDS like you have passed judgment by your rant.

    I bet you have NEVER studied the history of your religion (outside of the Bible) let alone other religions. I bet you have never been outside your comfort zone–having never traveled or met those of a different culture, religion or political view. I bet you have never ever met a gay person let alone had a close friend or family member come ‘out’ to you. So what? Well, it just reinforces your narrow, simplistic view of the world and those around you. It makes things nice and simple and easy for you. Unfortunately it also makes you sound C-R-A-Z-Y.

  122. Samuel Jones says

    Tank, I believe you haven’t fully understood what I wrote in my other posts. Think from a Christians perspective. Why would God have Moses write those Levitical Laws and Jesus Christ say something else. There were certain foods that were called unclean when Moses was alive that are foods Christians can eat today because God has cleansed them. What about the time when Jesus challenged anyone who has never committed a sin to throw the first stone at the woman who committed adultery? That was something Moses advocated. Retaliation is another thing Moses said was lawful that Jesus did not agree with. The proof(from a Christians viewpoint) is all in the Bible. There are alot of differences in terms of ethics and principles between Moses and Jesus Christ.

    The promise of hell is scary and that is one reason I try to obey Christ’s laws. The thing you forgot to mention was the promise of heaven. The end result should be Loving God vs. Vengeful God.

    What is your definition of evil?

  123. TANK says

    Evil is defined in theology and the philosophy of religion as unnecessary suffering. It is not a problem for atheists, just an unfortunate fact of life. For theists of any abrahamic faith which endorses a 3-O world creator, it is a serious problem, for free will could exist without unnecessary suffering–both human evil (no one chooses, freely, to commit evil) and natural (disease and disaster). I will not engage in theodicies, defenses, or other entry level stuff with you, however, just keep in mind that blabbing “Freewill” and appeals to ignorance…do not make up for it…don’t even begin to, actually.

    Hell is another theological problem for theists…right up there with the problem of evil.

    The rest is your interpretation of why the levitical law no longer applies. Leviticus isn’t the only offensive part of the bible…not afraid to say, and further, there is no reason to believe in it or look to it for guidance in lieu of actual ethics…

    But I don’t think you understood what I meant when I said that there’s no “true” interpretation of the bible…no right and no wrong…really, given that people who disagree with you can provide just as much evidence–textual and contextual even–to support their position as you can to support your own. THat’s a stalemate, and indicates that there is no meaning, and no true christianity…(no…the baptists don’t have it because they say they do…and the catholics don’t either…and the episcopalians don’t because they say they do, either…it’s silly). And it also indicates that you’re wasting your breath trying to appeal to those like a lot of the posters who’ve commented negatively in disagreement with you. But good job with michael…I guess.

  124. Michael says

    Snowed in Ohio, I understand what you are trying to say and I am doing what I can. I don’t think anyone in my family will ever come ‘out’ and that’s because they will get beaten and then disowned. Homosexuality is a thing that is very frowned upon in my family. I will not raise my children the way I was raised. The cycle has to stop somewhere and I’m going to stop it. Just last month I made a gay guy cry at my job by saying gay jokes. I never thought I could have a gay friend.(I have one now). He’s cool. Samuel Jones made alot of sense in his posts. I am just worried about the stuff someone in my family said will happen to me if I have a gay friend or gay friends. I do know that I will no longer make Adam and Steve jokes or other jokes like that.

  125. Snowed in Ohio says

    Michael; With all due respect, does that sound like a Christian thing to do to a loved one–or anyone? I hope you see how toxic any religion can be that makes people believe the “godly” thing to do when a family member comes out is to ‘beat’ and ‘disown’ them. Good for you for making a stand and breaking the cycle. It only takes one person. Doesn’t your soul feel 100% better for making this change? Listen to your instinct. It’s a much better guide than a religion that teaches intolerance, hate, etc. I am saying or suggesting you give up your faith, I am only HOPING you have the courage to explore your faith away from it. Shine a light on it and see it for what it is.

    I cannot fathom what you would be worried about ‘happening’ to you for befriending someone. I hope you learn to realize NOTHING will happen. You will grow. You will have a friend and enjoy the riches that come with having diverse friends. You can talk to him/her. Learn. Educate. Think of it this way. Now, while I don’t believe in the fire-brimstone and in organized religion in general, didn’t Jesus befriend the least of society–those that were shunned?

    For what it is worth, I think it is awesome that you are standing up and making the change. It takes a bigger man to do that than to give into the hate and ignorance.

  126. Anonymous says

    Yeah, I have to agree, I’m glad you befriended them. As a Christian, too many of my peers look down upon and disown anyone that’s “outside” of the religion. Christ said to love those the world hates. However, I also believe that my faith is the reason I befriend all types of people. Being a Christian, it is part of my duty during my time one earth to befriend all and spread the word of God, and I intend to do just that, whether it be through words or actions, and this is one of the many ways to show Christ’s love through action, befriending all.

  127. Logan says

    First let me say that God loves everyone, but he hates sin. And being gay is a sin, and God did not create sin. So stop saying that you born gay! No one borns a murderer, no one borns a thief, no one borns a whore. If I go out and sleep with a bunch of men I would be considered a whore. But it was my choice to lay down with those men and become a whore, so I didnt born a whore. So when you had sex with the person of the same sex then you became gay. Everything thats going on now the bible speaks of it. It said man will become lovers of themselves. Its an evil spirit and you all need to be delivered. Theres no little sin and theres no big sin. All of it is wrong and not of God. I just pray that God has mercy on all your souls. God Bless

  128. Logan says

    Rev. Bacon I pray that God has mercy on your soul. The bible also speaks of false teachers, I can’t believe you allowed the devil to use you. You are giving in to these people that have no idea what they are saying or doing. These people are worried about pleasing there flesh and doing what makes them happy then doing what pleases God. I hope you all find out the truth before it’s too late. Because if you don’t, when you do die, hell is where you will be when you lift up your eyes.

  129. TANK says

    First let me say that you, logan, are an unthinking, uneducated christotard. Second let me say that you are without argument. Third let me ask if you are proud of having religious beliefs that a keen child of six could categorically refute?

  130. TANK says

    And I say that, and all of what I’ve said antecedent to that, knowing that there are smart christians…devilishly intelligent theists like marilyn mccord adams. I have very good friends who have read the big summa (summa theologica) in latin and are extremely intelligent theists. They’re, of course, wrong… The point is that that there are stupid atheists as well as stupid believers…and you, logan, are an stupid believer because you simply don’t think…it’s the belief in belief itself (belief in faith), coupled with an excuse not to think by regurgitating other’s ideas.

  131. trine from Norway says

    Thank you to Rev. Ed Bacon for your statement at the Oprah show.
    In my opionion all people around the globe are equal no matter of rase, religion or whatever. If God do excist I am sure he of all persons is of the same opinion. Instead of sharing love and understanding with all people in the society – most churches has been doing the opposite. I do hope that Mr. Ed Bacons statement will open the eyes of all Christian societies around the globe. It’s really time for a change!
    We do leave in year 2009….
    All the best Ed Bacon – big hug from Norway

  132. Tyler says

    1) Matt is clearly not gay. Nice try though.
    2) I am gay. Being gay IS a gift from god…and a curse. It gives you a unique perspective. You can’t hide evil when it’s in front of your face everyday. No one needs to be reading any bible verses in the face of any gay person. We see hate and evil on scale you don’t even understand, that is our gift and our curse.

  133. says

    I wish people would evolve already and throw off the chains of diety worship. If everyone rose above the misguided and misdirected teachings of their respective

  134. gaele says

    i only heard about Rev Ed Bacon today as i live in Australia.What a blessing to hear him speak the truth about gay people. My son is gay and I have been so dissappointed in the ignorant attitude of some of the Christian church.I am a Christian and know that God loves gay people the same as hetrosexuals and it is the hypercrites in the church that have it wrong. Please dont shut out the love of God because of these idiots!

  135. Rea says

    If being gay was a so called “gift from God”
    wouldn’t God have made a way for gays to procreate with each other. Their race wouldn’t survive. Hmmmm? Doesn’t make much sense to me.

  136. says

    I wholeheartedly believe that you’re born gay. Being gay is not a choice. The only choice you have is choosing to act on a circumstance or situation, but that’s with anything in life. You always have a choice. But, as far as homosexuality we are born gay. There is no question about it. We are who we are and we are Proud To Be Different.
    Badge Society