1. dezboy says

    They said on CBS this morning that “close associates of Karl Rove” have recently taken over the McCain campaign. So, this is just the beginning of the nasty attacks to divert voters from the real issues.

  2. KFLO says

    McCain is just getting sad. I almost feel sorry for him…NOT!


  3. ThatsRich says

    Actually, McCain asked Obama to join him in a series of weekly town hall meetings in order to discuss the substantive issues but “the annoited one” so far has declined. If Obama is as interested in the policy issues as he claims than he would accept McCain’s invitation. Instead, Obama has chosen to chant a series of vapid slogans and soundbites in front of cult-like crowds.

  4. Larry says

    I just hope, at the end of the day, the American voters see beyond the fear-mongering, hate-baiting politics as usual. While I’m not naive enough to think Obama and his administration will be perfect (it’s hard to operate that way in an imperfect system), I strongly believe he’ll bring us into a world other than the arrogant, self-important one we’re in now. And I’d love to see Obama link McCain to Karl Rove more, given the man has just been found in contempt of Congress.

  5. ThatsRich says

    By the way, if you want to vote for a candidate and a party that actually supports full LGBTQ rights rather than merely providing condescending lip service to our community — as is done by the Democrats — then support Ralph Nader and the Green Party. Obama, Clinton and the Democratic Party are all frauds. Although the Democratic Party has been in control of Congress for the last several years, what bills have they passed in support of us . . . ENDA? Nope. Repeal of DOMA? Nope. End of DADT? Nope. Get a clue, people, the Democrats only hate us a little less than the Republicans.

  6. adam says

    This is horrible. The GOP need to pay attention to the actual issues this country is facing. This just shows how stupid they think the general american population is. It’s a sad day for this country

  7. Derrick from Philly says

    I believe that the Obama Campaign was prepared months ago that if he won the nomination the issue of race was going to be used by the Republicans. They must have strategies to deal with what’s coming from the Republicans, or else why would his initial supporters have asked him to run? THere must have been all kinds of research done on the changes in American’s racial attitudes–especially Americans under the age of thirty. This research led them to believe that Barack Obama could actually win the presidency.

    I don’t think they expected this ridiculous strategy by the Republicans to paint Barack as a “celebrity” with no more substance than Paris Hilton.

    My only satisfaction is that many Republicans must be looking and listening to John McCain and saying, “my God, he’s so boring you forget what the hell he’s talking about…so does he.”

  8. Zeke says

    THATSRICH, what’s REALLY rich is your shilling for McCain and then telling us to vote for Nader. It’s pretty clear that your purpose is to get us to vote for anyone but Obama so that your man McCain will have a snowball’s chance come November. You probably were linked here through the McCain talking point troll website and you’re probably not even gay. Either way it was a seriously lame attempt at compassion trolling.

    Oh, and for the record, “several” is more than three, usually considerably more than three but NEVER less than three. The Democratic congress was elected in November of 2006 and took control in January of 2007 putting them “in control of Congress” for just over a year and a half. That’s hardly “several years”.

  9. JeffRob says

    I think most Americans looked at the headline this morning: “McCain Camp Accuses Obama of Playing the ‘Race Card'”, and thought “Oh, come on.” What an absolutely ludicrous accusation.

    They hear Obama say things like: “The GOP is going to try to scare you, to make you be afraid of a potential President who doesn’t look like all the other Presidents….”, and they think “race card played”.

    I believe most Americans hear Obama say that and think “Damn straight, and Not this time!”

    Thatsrich: The Dems may “hate us a little less than the Republicans”, but Ralph Nader has as much chance of winning as my left nut. Your paranoia has gotten the better of you. Vote for real change. Let’s make this happen.

  10. says

    I simply think that this election is way too important to allow myself the luxury of wallowing in identity politics. I know Obama is less progressive than I would like when it comes to LGBT issues. I know, I know, I know. Those who don’t support him can just stop parroting that fact, because I already know.

    The important issues for me this year have nothing… repeat… NOTHING to do with purely LGBT issues. My issues are our illegal war in Iraq, the economy, environmental issues, health care access, education reform, the appointment of moderate to progresssive Supreme Court justices, and energy issues. I agree with Obama’s position on most of these, so I’ll be voting for him.

  11. Jason says

    I know Barack is trying to take the high road, but I really wouldn’t mind if he (or his surrogates. whatever) SLIT these fuckers’ throats (figuratively, of course). I know he can, but maybe it won’t come to that.

  12. says

    Zeke, sorry to disappoint you but I am gay, and you can check out my website if you would like. What I get a kick out of is gay people such as yourselves who decry efforts to stereotype the LGBTQ community but then you get your panties in a bunch every time someone does not march in lock step with your brain-washed self-deluded Democratic views by insisting that we all share the identical values. That’s a real celebration of genuine diversity, Zeke you clone. Unfortunately, you have so little imagination and creativity that you cannot understand the world beyond your black-and-white dividing line of Democrat and Republican, and realize that there is a much broader world that includes the Green Party. Go ahead Zeke and vote for Obama and the Democratic Party but don’t whine to me about the suffering of your oppression when nothing changes on the political landscape for LGBTQ rights. Remember, Zeke, Bill Clinton promised us the moon and the stars as well, and all we got was DOMA and DADT. God you live in a small, little world Zeke

  13. Derrick from Philly says

    “…insisting that we all share the identical values.”

    Is it only about “values”, THATSRICH? Isn’t it about human rights also? Who’s more likely to side with gay people concerning the right to be treated as a human being and an American citizen? Democrats? or Pat Robertson’s Party…I mean, Republicans?

    And Zeke aint no clone. He just feels that there are more things that should be important to gay folks than lowering their taxes. Gay folks (unlike Republicans) aint supposed to be greedy…not for money, anyway.

  14. GBM says

    Jeffrob, I totally agree. Actually, when my boyfriend and I woke up to read those headlines about McCain’s low tactics, we became really angry. So angry in fact that we were both inspired to contribute $ to Obama’s campaign. Hopefully more people will express their anger, vocally and monetarily, at McCain because I can’t take another 4 years of this divisive, vitriolic bullshit.

  15. Nick says

    Unfortunately America between the coasts will drink the kool-aid once again and vote for McCain. He is already neck in neck in most states Obama had 6-12 point leads a mere month ago. The fear and hate mongering by the Republicans has been successful in the past and whenever they bring out the 3 g’s-guns,god,and gays- they triumph. The industrial midwest does not make the connection between the Republican party and what they have lost. They turn inward and vote for the familiar time and time again. And in OH,MI,IN,and other states the race card is a big factor as there are many people who will not vote for Obama based on his race-period. FAUX News and the AM radio parrots for the RNC have been and will continue to mold the masses. There is nothing indicating otherwise this year. It is very sad and I wish the masses would educate themselves but they won’t-that takes energy and work Just this morning NPR indicated that 60 percent or more in FL want to drill overshore right now- and the feeling is growing. The citizens of this country evidently have to suffer more in order to find the courage to vote for change. It won’t be this year.

  16. GBM says

    I don’t know, Nick. While I have ongoing faith that the voting public will let me down, I also don’t think that this year is the same as 2004. The economy is a really big issue and McCain understandably polls really poorly for those issues. More significantly perhaps, I really don’t think McCain looks comfortable in his own skin with these increasingly nasty and manufactured controversies…it resembles Rove too much and seems like McCain is forcing himself to grimace and bear it to win the election. However, the American public does not like to vote for candidates who appear uncomfortable being themselves, whether Nixon or Kerry. Whether you like him or not, Obama’s campaign is consistently tailored to the candidate himself, and as a result Obama rarely seems as squirmishly uncomfortable as McCain so often does. Thus the Republican campaign a la Rovian acolytes is going full tilt but at the expense of their own candidate. My hope is that McCain’s disquieting and utter compromise of his own character, despite if not because of all the fearmongering, won’t be lost on swing voters who might conceivably vote for Obama instead.

  17. says

    “Gay folks (unlike Republicans) aint supposed to be greedy…not for money, anyway.”

    Wow, Derrick from Philly. Thanks for informing us all about what gays are supposed to be and not supposed to be. And what are you implying gays should be greedy for? What a caricature and cliche you represent. And although your obsession with Pat Robertson is revealing aren’t you aware that Ralph Nader and the Green Party in fact are not associated with the religious right or are you so drunk with the Democratic Party Kool Aid that you are unaware that there actually is a party with progressive values which you apparently do not support. Just click your heels three times while repeating “Change We Can Believe In.”

  18. Derrick from Philly says

    “…caricature and cliche you represent”

    Well, yeeeeah. What dull studio has you under contract? Republic?

  19. Zeke says

    THATSRICH, tells us that if gay people vote for Nader and McCain wins we’ll be better off than if we vote for Obama and Obama wins.

    THATSRICH, I may live in a small world, THATSRICH, but at least I live, THATSRICH, in THIS world, THATSRICH.

    Is it supposed to be clever to use a person’s screen-name “SEVERAL” times in one comment?

    And funny that you should call me a Democrat and gay “clone” since I’ve relatively recently become a Democrat (though I still don’t walk lock step with the party platform) and I’m HARDLY a gay clone, which you would know if you had been participating in Towleroad discussions for more than a week.

    It’s strange that when I and other gay voters vote Democratic based upon OUR “values” and OUR “family values” we’re called “single issue voters” and “clones” (regardless of how many issues we agree with the Democrats on), yet when a conservative person votes Republican exclusively over lower taxes, or abortion, or anti-gay rights, they are called “values voters” and “family values voters”. And why is it that when a gay person votes Republican almost exclusively over lower taxes or support for a hawkish foreign policy, he/she isn’t considered a “single issue voter”? Perhaps THATSRICH can explain why that is.

  20. says

    I’m so very ready for this fucking election to be over. To quote Doris Upson, “I’ve been ready for quite some time.”

    Let’s just get it the fuck over with.

  21. says

    “Instead, Obama has chosen to chant a series of vapid slogans and soundbites in front of cult-like crowds.”

    Who’s drinking the Kool Aid here? You’ve just said exactly what the Republican party wants you to say. Obama=cult=celebrity=vapid, and so on. Congratulations, Karl Rove gives you a gold star! The reality is that a Republican or a Democrat will be the next president. Ralph Nader (from the Narcissist Party) and the Green Party, whatever one thinks of their positions, are losing this November.

    So we can choose between McCain, who will carry on the Bush legacy nicely and who believes that gay people shouldn’t be parents and gay unions deserve no legal recognition, or Obama, whose policies are certainly much closer to the Green Party’s than McCain’s and who actually addresses gay rights without squirming in his chair or looking like he just swallowed Drano. I’ll choose Obama, imperfect as he and the Democrats can be, and if that labels me a clone, no problem.

  22. says

    Zeke, my poor man, try not to let your happiness in life be dependent upon whether Obama or McCain becomes the next president of the United States.

    The truth is that I have lived under a Republican Congress, a Democratic Congress, Republican Presidents, and Democratic Presidents. And you know what? I never had federally protected gay rights under any of them, and my day-to-day personal life never has been changed one way or the other under any of them.

    The Democratic and Republican parties are much more the same than you can appreciate, and my suggestion is that you learn to live your own life regardless of who is on office and you do not condition your happiness upon who is in office . . . because if you keep putting off your happiness until the day the Democratic Party affords us full equality, you may be waiting an awfully long time.

    And by the way, I don’t give a rat’s as about the war in Iraq or the treatment of detainees in Guantanamo Bay . . . and I bet you a quarter that no one else on this board is losing any sleep over the issue at night, either.

  23. says

    “And by the way, I don’t give a rat’s as about the war in Iraq . . . ”

    That’s right, who cares about the thousands of lives lost or the zillions of dollars spent on a war that shouldn’t have been fought in the first place, silly us. But I’m sure Zeke is reassured that you’re terribly worried about his personal happiness.

  24. Zeke says

    THATSRICH, your political outlook seems to revolve 100% around I, I, I, I, I and me, me, me, me, me. Just read your last comment. And you say MY world is small?

    When I became a husband and a father I lost the luxury of looking at the world through the I/me lense. How’s that for being a “gay clone”? My guess is that you’re wrong in your assumption that no one here cares about or loses sleep over the war in Iraq or the torture of prisoners. I think most people who comment here actually do care about what happens to people other than themselves; even people they don’t personally know. Radical idea, huh? It seems that it’s you who lives in a very small world. A world of ONE (talk about gay stereotypes). You sound much more libertarian than Green but I suspect that you’re neither when it comes right down to it; just another McCain shill concern trolling the pro-Obama sites.

  25. says

    “And by the way, I don’t give a rat’s as about the war in Iraq or the treatment of detainees in Guantanamo Bay…”

    Aaaaaand scene. Fade to black. Exit, stage left.

    Wow. No wonder so much of the world hates us.

  26. says

    “You sound much more libertarian than Green but I suspect that you’re neither when it comes right down to it; just another McCain shill concern trolling the pro-Obama sites.”

    You’re right that I have some libertarian sympathies but I am voting for Nader. And no I am not a shill for McCain — although for some pathological reason it gives you some comfort to think so. Isn’t it possible to dislike both McCain and Obama?

    And perhaps I am selfish by not caring about the war in Iraq and the treatment of detainees in Guantanamo Bay. But most voters in America and most people in the world are selfish. Do you think the people of Iraq or the typical soldier in our armed forces gives a rat’s ass about whether you or me have the right to get married and enjoy protection from discrimination on the basis of our sexual orientation? So you qualify for sainthood, Zeke, good for you; you obviously are a much better person than me. But I seriously doubt whether you lost a single’s night sleep over all those people killed in Iraq.

    What I want to know is why some many Democrats care more about the abuses in Iraq and Guantanamo Bay than about the way American citizens are treated in U.S. prisons. Guantanamo Bay is a paradise compared to your typical American prison . . . the reality is that the majority of Democrats don’t care about the Bush human rights but are raising the issue only to score political points.

  27. David R. says

    Excellent point, rationalize your own selfishness by pointing out that of others. That’s rich.

  28. says

    David R.:

    The self-righteousness of the fanatical Obama supporters simply is the flip-side of the self-righteousness of the religious right. Indeed, Obama’s constant self-references as a good Christian man, his repeated appeals to the religious right and his proposal to expand George Bush’s unconstitutional Faith-based Initiative Program is downright freaky. The Obama phenomenom is a case study in mass hysteria, and his cult followers are in serious need of professional de-programming.

    The truth is that Obama is just another political hack from the South Side of Chicago: he has made a deal with the Teamsters to end federal oversight into mob influence that has been in place since 1989; he wants to appoint John Edwards as his attorney general although Mr. Edwards is nothing more than a personal injury lawyer with no law enforcement background and has campaign ties to several convicted racketeers; he has flip-flopped on off-shore drilling, wiretapping policies and public financing of campaigns. That’s Change We Can Believe In.

  29. RB says

    WOW! I am so sorry that I came to this thread so late! However, Thatsrich, you do not know Zeke, my friend and brother. TRUST ME, Zeke and I do not see eye to eye on political issues, but he is NOT a small world guy!!! Zeke is an incredible individual that believes strongly in his family and NOTHING about him says I, me or selfish.

    He has made me see how someone can be a “liberal” and have family values AND be a wonderful person all at the same time. We do not always agree, but he is my friend and I am proud to defend him. (and trust me, he needs no defense as he can hold his own)

    Now on to your comments. The green party? Really? Dinner party for one now available. What do you want to accomplish. I am clearly NOT a dem and have always identified as a republican, maybe a little libertarian but green? NEVER! What would Nader do if he were actually elected president? And we are not even going to talk about the green party’s political relationship with Cynthia McKinney, nut job from GA! At least they kicked her to the curb.

    Look, I am totally terrified by Obama, yes I said it, terrified! He is absolutely the last person we need running the country but Nader? I would vote libertarian in a heart beat if they could leave the whole “drug” issue behind. Obama will bankrupt the country, worse than we already are and yet I cannot bring myself to vote for Nader nor Bob Barr. I am not always happy with candidate A or B, but at least A and B have a snowball’s chance in hell of getting elected. The last time I checked Nader and the green party couldn’t get elected dog catcher.

    And as for Zeke, love you my brother! I am still hoping that some of your conservative rural upbringing will come back to you. : )

    Thatsrich, you are way off base on Zeke. Zeke, Thatsrich makes some vaild points; we are not getting any rights from the democrats anytime soon. They pander to us but like us no better than the repubs. You and I have talked about this in the past. Just because you are not hated “as much” does not mean that you are loved. Having said that, no Pelosi and her congress have NO intention of granting us rights election year or not. Sorry, in that endeavor Thatsrich is not wrong.

    Take care

  30. says

    “Obama will bankrupt the country, worse than we already are . . . ”

    Since Bush has already done this so well, with huge deficits and the disastrous Iraq war etc., and McCain promises to carry on the Bush legacy, in addition to thinking gay people are unworthy of union recognition and parenthood, somehow I’m more terrified of McCain than of Obama. But I guess terror, like beauty, is in the eyes of the beholder.

  31. RB says

    Thanks Ernie. Perhaps I should have clarified something. I have NEVER voted for W, do not believe that he has been a good president and therefore stated it correctly, “worse than we already are”.

    Obama fully intends to double taxes and yes, make things worse than they currently are! There is aboslutely NO way he can implemend his programs without not only rolling back the Bush tax cuts but increasing taxes on top of that. Thereby doubling our taxes.

    I find it amazing that many here are not capable of looking beyond the dem party for any reason other than they are “better for us”! What have they done for us and why are they better? They pander for the gay vote and then give us nothing in return. We will get our rights one day, but much like civil rights it will be a bi-partisan effort to get it passed.

    Just tell me why you are a dem for once without saying they are better for us. Zeke did this and I understand what he believs in and why. Many here cannot do that. All I hear is “they are better for us”! Obama is not financially sound. McCain is not a great candidate, but Barr and Nader are not an option.

  32. 24play says

    If you’re more interested in looking at how families’ tax payments are likely to change under Obama or McCain, check out the graphic (created by the Tax Policy Center) that’s included in this post by Matthew Yglesias at the Atlantic:

    NOTE: The bars represent changes in after-tax INCOME under each candidate’s plan NOT changes in taxes paid.

    Under McCain, the richer you are the more money you’ll save. Under Obama, the opposite happens.

  33. says

    “Just tell me why you are a dem for once without saying they are better for us.”

    The same could be said for many Republicans here, who bash Obama without saying specifically why they support McCain/the Republicans, especially with regard to gay rights. (As I’ve said on previous threads, RB, I don’t accuse you of this. I know where you stand and respect your views, however much I disagree with them. Re: Bush, I respect McCain more than Bush–or used to, when he could legitimately be called a “maverick”–but I see their policies as currently very similar, particularly as McCain goes about wooing the right wing.) On gay rights the Democrats are better for us, locally and nationally. They just are. Compare the platforms and policies; compare who votes with us and who votes against us. (I’m not saying there aren’t good Republicans; I voted for James Jeffords in VT, before he left the Republican party in disgust. And not all Democrats are worthy of gay support.) I’m also pro-choice, for strict environmental and gun regulation, against Republican tax plans that favor the rich and corporations like Exxon . . . and so on. I can’t speak for others here, but if I say that Democrats/Obama are better for us, it is because they/he represent my views far better than the Republicans. (Zeke isn’t the only Democrat of intelligence here, believe it or not.) Frankly, on gay issues (generally the topic on Towleroad), I’ve yet to hear anyone convincingly argue why the Republicans are better. In fact I feel silly even writing that sentence.

  34. says

    “just tell me why you are a dem for once without saying they are better for us”

    RB, was that really a response to a post that cited “huge deficits and the disastrous Iraq war etc., and McCain promises to carry on the Bush legacy”? What part of deficits and war do you not understand?

    And re gay rights, yes, it will be a bi-partisan effort, when the last few bigoted holdouts in the Republican party join the Democratic majorities and vote for them. The votes on gay issues are always lopsided, ALWAYS with a higher proportion of Dems voting for them than Repubs. Always.