Comments

  1. KC says

    PLEASE TAKE THIS LINK DOWN!

    The more press he gets, the more he “get’s his message out.” He’s a sick F*ck. We already know that. Loughner isn’t worth taking up precious space on your site.

    Stay with what you guys do best…promoting positive GLBT stories and making us aware of important issues, causes, needs, and worthy news stories.

  2. mike says

    weird. schbozzy that must be one of his new words. well its ok to say weird things on a video and its ok to be in a bad place and upset about it. but he killed people and thats the problem hard to tell why he thought that was his answer. obviously some anger he seemed to be pissed at a professor for giving him a B.

  3. Todd says

    Simmer down now, KC and get off your high-horse. Now you’re telling Towleroad what they can and can not put up on their site?!

    Keeping the dialogue open about people with mental disorders and highlighting their behaviors so people not familiar with what to look for in an unbalanced individual IS an important issue. Well, apparently not to you.

  4. nick vaginitis says

    He says “I lost my freedom of speech to that guy”, referring to the instructor who exits the bldg. as Lougner walks by. I’m pretty sure it’s the same instructor I heard interviewed, who said Lougner interrupted classes continually and when asked to keep quiet, complained that his freedom of speech was being taken away. How many other unstable people are being slowly driven to insane violence by a constant news feed of lies, hate and misinformation? Granted, this young man was unstable to begin w/, but you cannot say entities like Faux News and the moronic rhetoric of (some) Tea Baggers don’t share some of the responsibility.

  5. ratbastard says

    He’s suffering from an organic brain disorder called paranoid schizophrenia, aggravated by serious substance abuse. Simple as that. He should have received professional mental heathcare. He should have been forced, if necessary. Laws and attitudes regarding mental health, dating mostly from the ‘Reform’ era of the 60’s and 70’s, make this very difficult to do.

  6. peterparker says

    RATBASTARD is right on this one…though it is possible Loughner’s paranoid thoughts were the result of substance abuse or psychosis due to bi-polar disorder, he is very likely a paranoid schizophrenic. He certainly presents that way. And only medication/psychotherapy can help that. Though clearly he should also be incarcerated to protect the public. At least for now.

  7. ratbastard says

    @Jesus,

    Naw. KC doesn’t have it right. KC (and U?) are political shills or tools.

    Jared Loughner is severely mentally ill. Being a ‘Progressive’ I’m shocked at your mean spiritness and lack of compassion.

  8. Bryan says

    Just think of all the toob hits to be had from spraying a few people with bullets! John Waters was right. What becomes a legend most? Handcuffs and a life sentence in an institution for the criminally insane.

    As Americans, we spend our lives trying to escape the world in which live for the one we worship on the other side of the glowing screen. If only more people realized how easy it is to cross the great divide. All it takes is a gun and the will to use it as publicly and messily as possible.

  9. says

    I agree with some of the other posters on here about his mental condition. As a Nurse Practitioner who has worked with thousands of patients like this over the past decade and as a Professor who has taught mental health, clearly he is a paranoid schizophrenic. I find it hard to believe his parents weren’t saware of his need for help. They have claimed they were unaware of his political beliefs and were shocked by his actions. But surely, they had to have known their son was ill. If he received help, perhaps this horrible atrocity could’ve been avoided. I am glad I watched this video. I still think he is a monster. But this does give more rationale for why he did the horrendous thing he did.

  10. Mark says

    There is a documentary called Hate.com that talks about how the modern access to media often emboldens, empowers, and mobilizes the warped or those with extreme views about society (i.e. racists, homophobes, militant types, etc). Where once this kind of crazy was a lone wolf, now he gets on the internet and can connect with hundreds just like him all over the world and feed off that collective outrage. This kid was probably on the internet being fed a constant diet of paranoia and vitriol that only fueled his rage and paranoid tendencies. Although he is obviously mentally ill, you can’t create the perfect environment for these kind of violent attacks to happen and then throw up your hands and say it wasn’t your fault when they do. Politicians and media people have the right to free speech, but with rights come responsibilities. That is the part so many of them choose to forget.

  11. Paul R says

    @Dr. Blackwell: I agree, but I’m sure his parents were quite aware of his need for help yet hoping he’d magically get better. Though if there’s any family history of schizophrenia, they have much less excuse. (Unless he was adopted; I’ve no idea.)

    @Mark: you’re correct, but long before the proliferation of hate media (online and otherwise), paranoid schizophrenics–who aren’t exactly noted for their social interactions–shared many nearly identical views on persecution by UFOs, mind control, lost/stolen rights, enemies posing as friends, etc. Obviously much of that is just standard paranoia, but it remains baffling that the similarities track so clearly for so long, given that untreated paranoid schizophrenics live in an impenetrable state most of the time. And. those issues are so often so identical across socioeconomic classes, countries, cultures, etc.

    But I guess I’m overthinking it; I suppose it’s basically always aimed at people or institutions that the ill fear could control them and/or they have no control over. Coupled with the delusions of schizophrenia…sad and bad (though usually to the person alone, not to others).

    So, as for the Tea Party and Fox, as much as a I loathe their ilk, I doubt they could penetrate and lodge a fixed place in his mind. Apparently he was a libertarian on some issues (which is usually either a bit or really nuts), but on others his views didn’t hew to one party or the other. He’s all over the map, because he’s mentally deranged.

    Anyone know what drugs he was doing? I thought the drug thing was several years in the past.

  12. ratbastard says

    Here’s an interesting article from the Arizona Republic newspaper. It has info I didn’t see anywhere else:

    http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2011/01/16/20110116gabrielle-giffords-jared-loughner-profile.html

    ‘At the end of Loughner’s junior year, in May 2006, the school nurse had him taken to the emergency room. “Extremely intoxicated,” the sheriff’s report would later say. It was 9 in the morning.

    Loughner told a deputy that he stole a bottle of vodka from his parents because his father had yelled at him.

    Loughner was changing. Drugs and alcohol blurred some days, but what friends remember most are the things he thought. Theories, ideas, strange questions.

    In Loughner’s latter two years of high school, friend George Osler saw him drinking and smoking marijuana more and more.

    He would go off on these tangents and then he would stop talking altogether,” Osler said. “He struck me as odd. It was an uncomfortable feeling.”

  13. Justice says

    Its interesting to see “normal” people respond to tragedy. I often spend more time with the comments than what towleroad has posted because I like the views expressed. But I am dismayed with how much anger a number of you have expressed as if you were somehow harboring a personality we had not seen before. Is that mental illness? There are a lot of ‘probablys’ in these posts as well. But that doesn’t seem to be stopping anyone from assuming facts not in evidence. A lot of “I am a professional…I have seen this before…I am the only one who knows wtf he’s talking about” blah blah blah. As long as I have been a follower of towleroad, this has always been the case, yet you don’t see it amongst yourselves and do not hesitate to limit your comments to what you do know in fact. Again I ask, is this mental illness as well? Thank you towleroad for all you do, for your continued guidance to material that the mainstream media overlooks, censors or just plain refuse to address. I share a majority of the material I have read here with my friends and family often with the response “omg, where did you get this stuff?” And to the other readers, thank you for your comments, insights and herlarious fodder for my stand up. :-)

  14. TJ says

    Okay, let’s say it’s all the fault of progressives who sought to de-stigmatize mental health issues. Let’s say anyone perceived as possibly dangerous should be detained (and longer than the 72 hours currently applicable in my state as well as others). Because if someone MIGHT kill, we should have the right to lock them up, right? Should this be along the lines of a citizen’s arrest, or should someone with some sort of training be involved? What is the standard, the threshold, that should be met? Currently, imminent threat is the standard in most places. Should that become looser – should we be able to lock up people for acting differently, or in a way that makes us uncomfortable? Were gonna need a LOT of facilities. And we’re gonna have to do a LOT of involuntary commitments, because if one fears one will be locked up for acting weird or having mental health issues, it doesn’t make seeking help very attractive.

    From personal experience: I perceived a threat, as a clinician, from a paranoid schizophrenic with a violent history, who was unmedicated and recently delusional and homicidal. This was a person who knew he was troubled and had been on medication in the past but became non-compliant because of side effects. When finally found, this person denied intent, so nothing could be done. But here’s the kicker: Had this person presented to the county mental health facility and asked to be voluntarily committed (as had happened in the past), he would have been turned away. Because of inadequate funding and high demand, the county hospital could only accept involuntary commitments. He would have to wait until he was dangerous, delusional, and unwilling to accept treatment before he got any.

    So, if we are going to blame progressives for de-stigmatizing mental health, who do we blame for de-prioritizing mental health? Who do we blame for cutting back services? Who do we blame for the attitude that says, “Get off your lazy butt and work for your health care, no government hand-outs for you!”(because people who are unstable surely are capable of holding down jobs, right?)? Progressives?

  15. ratbastard says

    Jared Loughner’s Mind Control Cult Video.
    Loughner embedded this on a post he made here:

    http://www.earthempires.com/jared-loughner-arizona-shooter-posts#thread_4

    The vid is here:

    It’s fascinating to read his posts and watch the video. He talks about how it’s ok to to rape if you’re horny and lonely, retarded people are useless and should be killed, mind control and children, beating and abusing them, ETC., VERY nihilistic. He had VERY violent thoughts and ideas.

  16. TJ says

    So, RATB, what is your plan? How do we put people we fear will cause harm away? Other than making people uncomfortable, no report that I have read at this point says that this guy made clear threats, or attempted harm. What would be your standard? And if your standard is met, what then?

  17. ratbastard says

    @TJ,

    I don’t know. Civil liberties of course must be respected, but guys like this must be locked up where they can’t hurt others. MANY people knew what he was like. His parents must have known how mentally ill he was. They actually could have had him involuntarily committed, at least for a set observation period. Maybe he could have been successfully put on a drug treatment regime and he would have never done the shooting. I think guys like him just need to be locked away. They can’t be left de-institutionalized. They’re too dangerous. But money is tight, and the mentally illness isn’t exactly a sexy topic.

  18. says

    The person responsible for upending proper treatment for mental health was Ronald Reagan, who decreed that as many asylums be closed as possible and the majority of the mentally ill be put on drugs. Sounds neat, doesn’t it? Except that the patients would either forget or discard their drugs, and there was no one put in charge of dealign with them ohterwise. This has resulted in all sorts of personal horror and much in the way of “disorderly conduct” crimes. Loughner would appear to be an extreme example of this in that he was never procribed and psychotropic medicine — or even paid a visit to a psychiatrist.

    “Ratbastard” will of course dismiss this completely.

  19. TJ says

    To an extent, I would agree that some people should be locked up. The person I dealt with surely would qualify, when unmedicated. But when adequately medicated, he was quite functional (successfully attending university). If functional (however tenuous that may or may not be), how does one justify confinement? I don’t have answers. I’m just pointing out that there are difficult questions raised. As I understand it, AZ law has provisions that are somewhat lower than imminent threat of harm. Had someone with the authority to evaluate and recommend temporary commitment seen Loughner, it seems there would have been little doubt that he would have been put on some sort of antipsychotic. But how would compliance be monitored? Through long-term commitment by the “nanny state” I often see decried?

    A friend’s son was schizophrenic, and often catatonic. After the Scientologists robbed him of all of his money, my friend had to take care of him – for 20 years. Eventually, he was on the right mix of drugs. He lived in a half-way house, and was thriving. Then, he stopped taking his meds. Long story short: He ran away, was found, was hospitalized. He freaked out so much at the hospital that he had a heart attack and died, at age 40. He had never been a danger to others, or himself. But it was a struggle. What commitment, as a society, are we willing to make to the long-term care of the mentally ill?

  20. Jesus says

    @RATB You got me! I’m just a “political shill or tool”, whatever that is supposed to mean. Is there a reason why you chose to insult me personally rather than comment directly on the topic at hand? Perhaps not, since this is the land of shoot first, ask questions later. And what’s with the quotations around “progressive”? Am I progressive, or are you? Who is the subject of this sentence, I ask you! Either way, the point I made is still very valid. People who are delusional like this guy want to make a name for themselves, so by giving him all this attention and making a big deal over it, he’ll be riding this wave of undeserved self-worth for some time. And hey, maybe other delusional people will see this and say “Now that’s something I can sink my teeth into” and go out to do the same. Or maybe they won’t. But when forensic psychologists are suggesting that downplaying these crimes are vital to preventing others from copying them, it doesn’t mean we disrespect those who were injured or killed, so please don’t get the wrong idea about what I was trying to say.

  21. anon says

    The biggest tell-tale sign of schizophrenia is chain-smoking. Was JLL a chain-smoker? It’s a form of self-medication.

    US mental health services in the 50’s and 60’s was horrific (One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest, anyone?) and was particularly bad for gay men. The only thing L Ron H ever did as a public service was to publicize the abuses. Reforms in the 70’s and 80’s consisted of several things: violent offenders were tossed into jail, where they received no special help; voluntary incarceration was encouraged; half-way homes were created with more autonomy for the patients. These things helped, but it did result in a large number of homeless men (mostly men) who needed help not getting any. Where before they could simply be rounded up for loitering, they were now often just left alone or given a bus ticket out of town.

  22. ratbastard says

    @TJ,

    We won’t. Mentally ill people are SCARY to ‘Normal’ people [scary in more ways than one.] And like I previously posted, discussion of mental illness IS NOT ‘Sexy’. The general public is for the most part ignorant on the subject. And we’ve got shills and tools like David here, who prefer to politicize EVERYTHING which turns MOST people off and results in a boy who cried wolf scenario.

    @David,

    Give it a rest,boss; like all propaganda, your arguments are full of half truths and you’re guilty of the sin of omission. The mental heathcare mess in the U.S., and those responsible for creating it, go back much further than Reagan [who also played a role]. Back to the ‘Reform’ era that started with Pres. Kennedy in the 60’s and into the radical leftist ‘Reforms’ and social engineering that dominated the late 60’s and 70’s.

  23. ratbastard says

    @Jesus,

    Paranoid schizophrenics suffer from an ORGANIC brain disorder; do you appreciate this? Jared Loughner is as PHYSICALLY [as well as psychologically] ill as a cancer patient.

    And it’s POINTLESS to ascribe any deep meaning to his thoughts and actions. There are none. They’re just manifestations of his organic based brain disorder.

  24. says

    This just breaks my heart. Obviously, Jared Loughner should never be allowed in public ever again, but’s he clearly psychotic and incapable of understanding the seriousness of his actions. The stories his former friends and classmates tell of him having once been a normal, likeable guy (who excelled at math, had a girlfriend, played saxophone in the school band) makes this story especially tragic. Paranoid schizophrenia typically manifests around the age of 20 (and usually among males), and Loughner’s disintegration certainly fits this timeline.

Leave A Reply