1. Francis says

    Just so disgusting. Even though others have brought up Mr. Hall’s police record and potential contributing factors as to why this incident occured, ultimately, no-one deserves something like this to happen to them. And from what I read, this is at least the 6th hate crime in this same area alone this summer. The inadequate police response just highlights the culture that creates incidents such as this to continue to occur.

    This is why I and many others always say, if you’re openly gay and out and about at night, anywhere but IN PARTICULAR places like Utah and other traditionally anti-gay cities and states, you have to carry something to protect yourself, because sadly, you’re not safe.

  2. ratbastard says

    as far as gay victims of real hate [anti-gay] crimes are concerned, I wouldn’t trust the police even in the famously gay-friendly city and state I live in. And I wouldn’t that there are more real [not imagined or made–up] anti-gay assaults and so-on in my town [or in nYC, L.A., Atlanta,etc.] proportionately than in places like Utah.

    If you can’t or won’t learn to defend yourself [and hate cops] be very careful of your surroundings, who you’re with, and avoid situations and places where potentially can be targeted. Everyone else should be allowed legally the tools and legal leeway to defend themselves, including [gasp!] guns.

  3. says

    RATBASTARD is right. Crime-prevention tactics (like the buddy-system that Dane Hall admitted he will now use) help us before the crime happens. Hate-crime laws help us after the crime happens. The most effective way to stop crimes when they happen is with a firearm. Firearms might not stop every crime, but FBI statistics show that they improve the odds greatly in favor of the victim. BTW, while Utah isn’t a necessarily a gay-friendly state, its capitol city, Salt Lake City (where this attack took place) is very gay friendly. The politics of the city and state combine to make a great environment for gay Second Amendment groups like Stonewall Shooting Sports of Utah.

  4. Francis says

    100% agree with Rat in this case, in that ultimately, as this story, the Marcellus Andrews story, the Miami Beach incident, the Washington DC incident where the lesbians were attacked, and several more, all highlight the fact that although an overall culture may be gay friendly, the police force by and large are not and we are responsible for our own protection.

    Also as I’ve said before, the response of the city when it comes to incidents such as this really are a test that decides whether that city is truly gay positive or not. As Cowboy said, the lack of any sort of press on this story until several days after it happened, the fact 6 or more have occured in this same area with no real response, the lack of response by the police after the fact, does not speak kindly to Salt Lake City’s attitudes of their LGBT citizens.

  5. Joey says

    David could you please supply a link to the statistics you report: “FBI statistics show that they improve the odds greatly in favor of the victim.”


  6. Rocky says

    @ Joey

    There’s no concrete statistics to back up David’s asinine comment.People can pull the most ridiculous statistics out of their ass to coincide with their usually backwards opinions on things.Just another gun taunting lunatic who should be locked in solitary confinement.

  7. antb says

    the act of “curb checking” should be classified as attempted murder. he could easily have been killed by that and the thugs who did it didn’t care – that was probably the point.

  8. says

    JOEY, here are just three proofs:

    –Firearms are used to defend against crime in the United States up to 2.5 million times a year (Kleck, Gary and Marc Gertz. “Armed resistance to crime: The prevalence and nature of self-defense with a gun.” Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, vol. 86, issue 1. Chicago: Northwestern University School of Law. Fall 1995.).

    –Firearms are used six times more often in the United States to defend against crime than to perpetrate it (Michael, Rand. “National Crime Victimization Survey.” Washington: U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics. 1973-2008.).

    –An individual who uses a firearm defensively in the United States is up to 2.5 times more likely to survive a violent crime than an individual who is passive (Michael, Rand. “National Crime Victimization Survey.” Washington: U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics. 1973-2008.).

    But, there are many more proofs which are published by various researchers and universities. To save the reader some time in searching for the most compelling proofs, see online (Smith, Guy. “Gun Facts 6.0.” Henderson, Nev.: Guy Smith. 2011. .). Yes, the editor is a Second Amendment advocate. But, it is the citations that you should be looking for, not his opinion.

    Note: I won’t be drawn further into a firearm debate within the comments of this news report. It is neither the time nor place to argue gun control beyond the idea that firearm use is one way to effectively defend against hate crimes.

  9. Derek in Madison says

    David Nelson. THANK YOU! As a person who grew up in Northern Minnesota, understood how to handle a firearm safely at 12 years old, spent years hunting, and then moved to the big city, I applauded my state (WI) for passing a new concealed carry law. When it comes down to it, I am competent with firearms. As will be my partner, and will, eventually, my children.

    There is not a chance in HELL I would cede the privilege of gun ownership, provided for in our constitution, to those who least deserve it–criminals… and you can bet your ass they have them (thanks to the Repugs making it so damn easy to get them).

    You are 100% correct. It is ONE means of self defense. I employ many–mostly, I’m just big, scary, and ready to kick any mother-effing hater’s ass if they trifle.

    End of story :)

  10. Randy says

    We have crime in Canada, but we don’t resort to handguns to deal with it. All we have to do is look down south to see pretty clearly that it doesn’t work.

  11. ratbastard says


    Most ‘gun’ crime in the U.S. is committed [VERY disproportionately] by a demographic that makes up roughly 6% of the over-all population. We have a problem with predatory violence, gangs and violence surrounding illegal drug trafficking. Most of the violence occurs in well defined urban areas, and is committed by ethnic and racially based gangs. The vast majority of citizens are not involved and live in relatively safe areas. There’s been zero shootings or murders in my big city neighborhood for years.

    Peaceful, law abiding citizens shouldn’t be penalized for the bad actions of others.

  12. billmiller says

    I kind of agree with Dave up there, maybe we should all be armed and start shooting the bashers, or learn self defence like Karate and Judo. Most of us, like me are rather timid and not inclined to violence…but…

  13. Johnny says

    I am a 54 years old and Gay here in Salt lake City Utah..
    Those who remember ACTOR “Paul Lynn” back in the 70’S was ARRESTED coming out of a GAY BAR by the SALT LAKE CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT just because he was GAY and they wanted to try and ruin his acting career!I can remember, on many occasions, when the Salt Lake Police was ever called, from a Gay Bar or Bath House, for what ever the reason may of been, 95 percent of the time the Police would NOT show up!
    The Mormons are behind all of this bashing!
    They run this STATE and they hate us Gay Men and Women.. Because we do not BREED! The occult/Mormons in the past and still do this very day, have a team of men call the “DANITES” who are assassins for the Mormon Church and they still are active even in this day and age.
    You may think I am Crazy but do your home work on the Mormons…Mountain Meadow Massacre ring a bell??? If they would kill hundreds of INNOCENT Men, Women and Children then, what would stop them from KILLING US GAYS now? They are in Control of the FBI, POLICE, every single branch of the law and all the POLITICAL LEADERS are Mormons.. They have power and now they are using it to KILL US,to RUN US OFF with the FEAR OF OUR LIVES! We must fight FIRE with FIRE!!! WE THEY LGBT of UTAH, MUST EXPOSE THE MORMONS and all branches of LAW ENFROCEMENT, AND THERE POLITICAL LEADERS to the REST of this Country and the WORLD of what kind of CORRUPT and EVIL PEOPLE THEY ARE IF WE ARE TO EVER SURVIVE IN THIS STATE OF EVIL PEOPLE WHO CALL THEMSELVES ” MORMONS!!

  14. lewlew says

    Could we retire the term “gay bashing”? This term trivializes an assault on a gay person. It diminishes the act, makes it sound cartoonish. We may need something like “bigotry assault” or better than that. But please…