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1. Simpleton

   Posted by: GM | Feb 15, 2007 3:17:25 AM

   
   

2. 1. what he said was something that someone is uneducated and homophobic would say
   2. apparently he doesn't know or have any out gay friends or family memebers; especially gay white friends
   3. grab your pearls - what gets me is how someone can equate what he said, which is totally inappropriate, with the African American experience in history. nope can't do it. you see being black and gay - gbm - gets you a two for one racism card. many white gays don't associate with str8 or gay blacks and are usually racists to blacks and to gay blacks. don't get me wrong, preference for who you date is one thing but totally not socializing with a group of people because you "choose" not to is another. i take the movie that i don't like - love! valour! compassion! - it's totally white. not one of the eight has any gay black friends (maybe i'm stretching this a bit - it's just a movie and doesn't immate real life).
   4. what if a white str8 guy said the exact same words - what would the comeback be for that person - race wouldn't be an issue - and it should not be because one black person says something wrong against gays

   when a gay person, especially a gay white person (assuming here), says something to the effect that his kind use to.... says a ton to me...instead of saying our horrible history had a time where blacks in this country were treated worse than second class citizens and for he as an individual to take that tone given one of our bleak moments in history is somewhat ironic; still a stretch since there are some gay clubs, bars, and spas that make it known (with clever ways too) that blacks are not wanted there in 2007.

   it use to be we were all in this together. was stonewall only blacks, was it only whites? i don't know, i have to read about that. when was the last time you saw an advertising photo portraiting two gay black men as a loving couple in a gay white magazine? and logo broke ground with a majority gay black character driven story and some latinos only to be cancelled after 2 seasons; there is a rumor that they are taking it to the big screen but i believe it when i see it. logo's premiere show that got people to logo and they cancel it after 2 seasons without bringing the story to completion. at least bring it back for a third season and complete the writing of the series - then launch it into a movie. duh.

   one thing i do know is the last time i was called a n***** to my face was by a drunk white man (assuming that he was gay) in a gay bar and the last time that I was hugged lovingly for just being in a gay bar was by a gay white guy man. and he told me to come back and visit the club for sure. the first guy doesn't mean that all white gays or str8 - bi - trans whites are racist. just that one person was stupid. and that is what you should take from Tim. stupid because he has most likely interacted with gays for a while (closeted ones) and possibly with gays in the locker room and guess what, none of them most likely wanted him; sexually or otherwise. ignorance and fear will make anyone not educated say something stupid. now where were the gay guys standing up for charles barkley when publicly announced his support for gays; did glaad applaud him, was he on blog after blog applauded, or has that been forgotten already?

   Posted by: CC | Feb 15, 2007 3:32:21 AM

   
   

3. Dave, your comment about "people of his ilk" was completely unnecesary.
   He's obviously a bigoted and possibly uneducated individual, but he in no way represents the view of his "people" which also happens to include the very NBA player who was very brave decision to come out like he did.

   Its a sad sad commentary on the gay community when we start making assumptions because of someone's color. Why not just judge the individual???

   Posted by: moi | Feb 15, 2007 3:58:22 AM

   
   

4. My issue here is not that he's black, but that clearly he is a member of a minority and - as such - must have some history of feeling like the "other" in this society. I think it is worse for a person of a minority to be prejudiced than for an old white guy who doesn't know how it feels to be victimised.

   Okay, I don't know the personal history of Tim Hardaway - maybe he had the perfect life before now. Maybe he's never felt the sting of prejudice because of the colour of his skin. Maybe that's true of Isaiah Washington as well. It seems remarkable that both of them would escape at least understanding what bearing the brunt of ignorance is like.

   This is, by no means, to suggest I'd go easy on the reverse situation. Rosie O'Donnell imitating the Chinese language in a very childish way was also offensive - and again this struck me as worse because surely Rosie has also come against prejudice in her life.

   Racism is bad and homophobia is bad. For a black man or a gay woman to not realise this makes me worry about how it's possible to educate people who have never suffered prejudice for something they cannot change about themselves.

   Posted by: crossoverman | Feb 15, 2007 4:42:47 AM

   
   

5. Whenever some person says hateful things about gay people there are always those that say he or she is self-hating. Apparently if it weren't for those evil gays, gays would be a lot better off. Straight people are just angels to Todd M., JoJo, and JonJon who use anti-gay bigotry to justify their positions.

   There are a lot of straight people that hate gay people. Get that through your head.

   Posted by: Jack! | Feb 15, 2007 5:00:34 AM

   
   

6. Oh, no, another battle in the race war has begun. You want people to see you for more than your sexuality, in good times AND in bad times, but you can't do the same when it comes to race. Thanks, for proving AGAIN that race will always be the defining civil rights narrative in this country, not sexual orientation.

   Posted by: FanGirlHater | Feb 15, 2007 5:09:01 AM

   
   

7. When will people recognize that Isaiah Washington and Tim Hardaway are INDIVIDUALS, not "representatives of a community"? We don't go around saying the WHITE COMMUNITY is homophobic whenJOHN ROCKER, DR. JAMES DOBSON, MEL GIBSON, PAT ROBERTSON, EMINEM, etc. make homophobic statements.

   Even while Washington and Hardaway are making these idiotic comments, the Congressional Black Caucus--ya know, people who make LAWS--have been recognized as the most GAY-FRIENDLY group in Congress.

   So don't you go painting the black community with one brush either.

   Posted by: Ubiquitous | Feb 15, 2007 5:36:41 AM

   
   

8. Like it or not, Professional sports is a bastion for straight males. Bleeding heart liberals can bitch and whine about homosexuals not being accepted in the lockeroom, but in the end, it's the breeders and straight men who rule and continue to watch professional sports. The demographics and ratings don't lie.

   Democratic and leftist whiners should stick to watching Oprah or the Ellen De'Generate show.

   Posted by: Leroy McMaster | Feb 15, 2007 5:51:37 AM

   
   

9. It's o.k. I hate basketball, so me and Hardaway are even.

   Posted by: Scan | Feb 15, 2007 7:02:55 AM

   
   

10. I agree with Ubiquitous.

    Posted by: Jack! | Feb 15, 2007 7:05:31 AM

    
    

11. "There are a lot of straight people that hate gay people. Get that through your head."
    Posted by: Jack! |

    Great post. That's the bottom line of this article to me : There are infinite quantities of straight people who hate gays and they are out there. They may or not say it, but it's a reality.
    http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?S=15&F=1720&T=121418&P=1
    http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1785093/posts

    I'm sorry but reading this story did not affect me one bit! I've stopped giving a shit about what straight individuals have to say about our community a long time ago. It doesn't reach nor upset me, because I know this is what a lot of them think intimely.

    And to see us actually miss the point (and to me it's really missing the point) by turning it into a race argument amongst us, makes me think that as a community we're not interested in uniting and moving on up. Become a powerful political force. We still don't believe in a queer identity and dream and common goal. sadly we don't want it.

    So I suggest we keep on adoring the PR-savvily ready hetero celebs who have not (yet) lost their cool on the air and said how they truly feel about us. Let's keep burrying our heads in the sands! And let's keep ignoring our queer siblings, of all colors and genders, and focus our attention on finding the 'straight heros who loved us'.

    Posted by: Da | Feb 15, 2007 7:08:03 AM

    
    

12. The "news" in this, for me, isn't what Mr. Hardaway said, but the way the NBA dealt with it. I will confess to some surprise that they were so quick to condemn it. Well done. Incidentally, this isn't a racial issue and it's totally inappropriate to frame it as such.

    Posted by: JT | Feb 15, 2007 7:35:25 AM

    
    

13. Notice he apologized for saying it, not for believing it.

    D-2, don't worry about having to explain things because you aren't capable of explaining anything in any manner remotely resembling logical. You are doing *exactly* what you accuse others of doing:
    "It was completely unnecessary especially when our great tolerant gay community isn't so open-minded when it comes to interracial relationships and sometimes friendships. There's been reports of blacks and asians being denied entry to clubs and bars and there's even been reports of anti-black slurs being slugged around in the Castro.

    The point is is that no one should make these judgements (that whoever should be more tolerant simply because of past injustices) because of things they can't change such as race, religion, sex, maybe even circumcision, etc, when no community is free of shameful conduct."

    The point is that people who are part of a group that has experienced discrimination should know how much it hurts to not do it to others. And on the subject of the open-mindedness and inclusion you think is so rampant everywhere in "minority" communities, when was the last time you saw a parade for "white gay pride" or "jewish gay pride"? Preferences for cut, uncut, white, black, mixed, etc. are personal preferences that people have a right to - and you are an ass for 1.) trying to make people feel guilty and 2.) trying to make it any of your fuking [sic] business!

    Posted by: shane | Feb 15, 2007 7:45:30 AM

    
    

14. What I find MUCH more disturbing than this asshole's publicly professed bigotry is the fact that the overwhelming majority of the comments on BOTH sites that I've read this story, are supportive of and in agreement with him.

    In fact a poll at one of the local CBS station's websites ask people's opinions about the comment. It has a multiple choice list of answers to choose from. The leading answer to this point is, it's "What most people believe."

    If you want to contribute to the poll, you can find it at:

    http://cbs4.com/topstories/local_story_045205258.html

    Maybe we can link bomb it from gay friendly sites and change the results.

    Like I said, I could care less what this ignorant asshole has to say. He has a right to be stupid. But the responses are disheartening, to say the least.

    Posted by: Zeke | Feb 15, 2007 8:08:44 AM

    
    

15. They were laughing about this on NBC's Today show this morning...saying "over the line" etc. but they were still laughing!

    Posted by: dj | Feb 15, 2007 8:26:59 AM

    
    

16. They were laughing about this on this morning's NBC Today show...saying "over the line" etc. - but they were still laughing not gasping!

    Posted by: dj | Feb 15, 2007 8:29:42 AM

    
    

17. "What I find MUCH more disturbing than this asshole's publicly professed bigotry is the fact that the overwhelming majority of the comments on BOTH sites that I've read this story, are supportive of and in agreement with him."

    Um, that's because the CBS4 story is linked to from the very top of DRUDGE REPORT. I imagine most of Drudge's readers are skewing the votes.

    Posted by: Ubiquitous | Feb 15, 2007 8:35:56 AM

    
    

18. "There are a lot of straight people that hate gay people. Get that through your head."

    Jack you have made this argument before. What I think YOU need to get through your head is just how many closeted homos there are in the world who are so ashamed of their secret that they will lash out at open gays and are capable of some pretty ugly behavior.

    There is no doubt that there are plenty of good old fashioned straight bigots in the world. But people who go out of their way to express their disgust are MANY times just trying to convince the world that they themselves are not gay.

    I speak from experience because I used to protest a lot myself before I came out - though I never said hateful things, I just fell back on my religious upbringing to express why I didn't "approve" of it. And I have spoken to many gay men who say the same.

    Perhaps your life experience is different from mine and you never had to deal with these kinds of feelings. All the better, because you are fortunate if you didn't.

    But make no mistakes, there are plenty of GAYS who HATE GAYS in the world.

    Posted by: mark m | Feb 15, 2007 8:39:16 AM

    
    

19. it's a shame that the NBA doesn't throw in educations with those jinormous salaries.

    Posted by: A.J. | Feb 15, 2007 8:42:20 AM

    
    

20. "What I find MUCH more disturbing than this asshole's publicly professed bigotry is the fact that the overwhelming majority of the comments on BOTH sites that I've read this story, are supportive of and in agreement with him."
    Posted by: Zeke |

    I hear you Zeke, but it doesn't surprise me. I spend a lot of time on the web, and what I've learned is that haters on the hetero side are very much united when it comes to hating or excluding gays. Wasn't there a story recently in which we discussed how extremist christians and muslims are uniting to hold conferences and rally against gays in the UK? it happens. That's why it makes me sad when we cannot form the same unity within our community to fight against the common enemy, heterosexism.

    "Maybe we can link bomb it from gay friendly sites and change the results."

    Ok, but personally I wouldn't to do it for that..I think the gay community needs to witness the links precisely to get a wake up call!

    I sincerely believe we're the ones doing the greatest cultural contribution to upholding the ideals which opress us all; instead of working actively to SUBERT that culture in our favor. It's all up to us.

    So I feel a good dose of reality is needed for us to realize just what denying our own power lends us to.

    Posted by: Da | Feb 15, 2007 8:43:55 AM

    
    

21. at least he is honest, so i know where he stands, so AVOID THE BASTARD.

    Posted by: johnosahon | Feb 15, 2007 8:44:12 AM

    
    

22. too bad the NBA doesn't throw in educations with those jinormous salaries.

    Posted by: A.J. | Feb 15, 2007 8:47:14 AM

    
    

23. it's a shame when anyone's hate comes bubbling up to the surface.. kudos to the NBA for pulling him from representing them so quickly.

    Posted by: Darren | Feb 15, 2007 8:47:20 AM

    
    

24. charles barkley when publicly announced his support for gays; did glaad applaud him, was he on blog after blog applauded, or has that been forgotten already?

    Posted by: CC | Feb 15, 2007 3:32:21 AM

    Excellent point. I never knew that Charles Barkley publicly supported homosexuals and tolerance, and it saddens me that his support within the intolerant sports community wasn't duly recognized. I have much new found respect for Barkley...

    Now, while I certainly agree with you that race, gender, religion, ad nausuam shouldn't play any role in one individuals beliefs, I believe the point certain individuals are attempting to make is that when one particular group (may it be african-americans, japanese americans, etc.) has been persecuted due to their race or beliefs then turns around and treats another in the same way they have been treated it is a bit ironic and sad, mainly due to the fact that they did not learn anything from their own persecution. I completely understand your point, that the individual is responsible for their own ignorance and that historical racism should not play a factor, and by jumping to his African-American roots and persecution is simply displaying racism and ignorance thus creating a vicious cycle. Of course, in a perfect world none of this would be an issue, Hardaway's homophobia and general racism in the straight and gay community. However, psychologically speaking, it does make a little sense that given the U.S.'s historically racist background that Hardaway would in the least have learned what it feels like to be persecuted and have shown some respect when discussing his beliefs. Of course, he is entitled to his opinion and certainly racism may not change an individuals own beliefs, however intolerance would surely have been addressed at some point in Hardaway's life...

    In short, we don't live in a perfect world, and while in some instances the world is what you make of it, we are still human beings first. It is sad that after the U.S.'s racist background that people in GENERAL have not learned the valuable lesson of tolerance and acceptance, especially the population that was personally persecuted during those difficult and horrible days. In the end, tolerance and acceptance start at home, each and every one of us should take the time in thinking past black and white, and realizing when we are all dead and buried, color, gender, religion, do not matter...

    Posted by: Cory | Feb 15, 2007 8:48:44 AM

    
    

25. "charles barkley when publicly announced his support for gays; did glaad applaud him, was he on blog after blog applauded, or has that been forgotten already?"

    What I remember about that story on Towleroad were the comments that said it was no big deal because Charles wasn't running for political office, so his views didn't mean anything, or the same tired argument that we gays are so starved for acceptance that we jump on anything positive a straight man will say, regardless of whether he MEANS it or not.

    So which is it folks? Do we applaud him? Ignore him? Demean him because he's JUST a black man? Do we hold him up on a pedestal BECAUSE he's a black man? Do we ignore him because he's straight? Do we thank him for taking a position that may be unpopular in professional sports?

    I guess it depends on what your own prejudice is.

    Posted by: mark m | Feb 15, 2007 9:08:32 AM

    
    
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