Comments

  1. Paul R says

    Maybe the earpiece makes it easier for him to hear the voices in his head.

    Secret Service agents aren’t allowed to protest, so unless this was some kind of undercover test (which they don’t do in public), it seems unlikely that he’s an agent.

  2. Jordan says

    Oh, NO! Let’s all go into hysterics because someone has a GUN! HOW MUCH TIME SHOULD WE DEVOTE TO THIS ON MSNBC?! A few hours should do it.

    He wasn’t even near the entrance to the high school. What did you think was going to happen? He was going to go renegade and take out all the security, all the Secret Service, and then try to assassinate the President?

    What a joke this ‘story’ is.

  3. paul c says

    I hope we’re not honestly going to tie Thomas Jefferson into terrorism and extremism now.

    This is the shit that happens when people feel marginalized — they become desperate. When the first protestors, who seemed to be mainly the elderly, began to get publicity, cooler heads should have addressed their concerns and worked to calm them down. Instead, they were derided and mocked by politicians and the media — labeled extremists, mobs and wackos. None of which they were.

    But as is usually the case, hearing mention of “crazies”, “mobs” and “violence” perks up the ears of the actual crazies, mobs and Michael Jackson fans and draws them in for the excitement. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.

    Instead of ordering their followers to “punch back twice as hard”, Obama & Pelosi and company should have addressed the situation in a respectful and intelligent way…not made outright suggestions of impending physical violence.

    This has been so embarrassingly mishandled that it will be a miracle if they can ease the situation before serious violence occurs.

  4. Jordan says

    The President of the United States is close to guns all the time, Derek.

    He wasn’t close to this guy’s, though. Nothing was going to happen. Nothing did happen. As expected. He had every right to strap that gun to his hip and protest. Deal with it.

  5. says

    No Jordan, I won’t “deal with it.” I wouldn’t even want Bush that close to guns. Remember how many shoes that Iraqi guy got to hurled at Bush before he was taken down? What if that been a gun. Obama can’t dodge bullets.

    I have no problem with the 2nd amendment. I do have problems with people who don’t see anything wrong with turning up to a Presidential visit with a loaded gun. If you don’t have a problem with that, I feel sorry for you.

  6. Steve says

    Oh please. “Apparently this is legal in New Hampshire”

    Actually, this is legal most everywhere. The Bill of Rights guarantees us that privilege. You remember, the same Bill of Rights that allows you to maintain this blog… Let’s remember all of our rights, rather than pick and choose those that we like.

    Signed,
    Proud, gun toting homo who is for health care reform

  7. Steve says

    Derek –

    The same bill of rights that allows you to post on this blog, the same bill of rights that allows this blog to exist, also allows this gentleman to carry a loaded weapon.

    If you are willing to say that this guy didn’t have the right to carry his gun, you must also be willing to accept if someone else says that you shouldn’t have the right to state your opinion on this blog – or for this blog to exist.

  8. jimmyboyo says

    logcabinites

    The supreme court INTERPRETS it as one’s right to bear arms

    the actual constitution read strictly says otherwise

    “A well REGULATED militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”

    strictly read without judical activism of repub judges = citizens can bear guns as members of STATE run/ sponsored/ maintained/ and regulated militias

    Not doing state militia duty under the supervision of the governor or someone designated by the duly elected governor then you have NO right to bear arms

  9. jimmyboyo says

    PS

    it is not for individuals to rebel against their government, but it is for the states led by their governors to rebel against the fed government.

    sorry folks. No guns for U

  10. Alex says

    Yes, carrying a weapon is legal in most states with a permit and I am most certain that secret service is better at their job than MSNBC so I sincerely doubt that Obama was anywhere near in danger. This is just MSNBC’s attempt to demonize the people who are protesting health care reform, painting them as extremists and lunatics. It’s a shame that standing up and screaming for what you believe in has become something of disdain. I don’t tolerate threats of violence, but I’ll fight for the right of every moron in this country to stand up in a town hall and yell as loud as they want before I’ll live in a place where we have “change” railroaded down our throats and have no right to express our disdain for it.

    I think unfortunately a lot of crazy people have clouded the legitimate arguments there are against Obamacare. But overall I think it is working. So maybe these people aren’t as dumb as MSNBC (or this blog) would paint them as.

  11. Alex says

    Oh and I don’t know if any of you have been to New Hampshire, but welcome to the wild Northeast my friends. I’m shocked they only found one person proudly displaying their gun.

  12. says

    “This has been so embarrassingly mishandled that it will be a miracle if they can ease the situation before serious violence occurs.”

    So if a violent act did occur it would be the fault of “Obama & Pelosi & company” and the media for making people feel marginalized and not the fault of the person who carries a loaded weapon to a public event involving the president? Wow.

    These people talk about their rights being taken away, but what rights are these exactly? They have been allowed to speak. They have been allowed to carry their guns. Would a person with a loaded gun have been any more acceptable in the vicinity of a Bush town meeting? Of course not. (Dissenters of any kind were usually kept far away from Bush town meetings.) If people are going over the edge because of their inability to comprehend or constructively add to a debate about health care, it’s not anyone’s fault but their own.

    Coming to terms with the fact that someone you virulently disagree with is president is part of what being a US citizen is about–many of us managed to accomplish it during 2 Bush terms. They need to accept that Obama is president and act like mature citizens.

  13. Alex says

    Jimmybono = better interpreter of the US Constitution than the Supreme Court.

    Don’t get me wrong, I tend to agree, but that is besides the point. Federalism would still say that if New Hampshire allows its citizens the right to bear arms, they still have that right. And clearly New Hampshire does. And if you’ve ever been there, you’d know that even absent a 2nd Amendment, that state would still allow its citizens to bear arms.

  14. greg2 says

    Whats going to happen when national black leaders start telling black people to arm themselves against people of this nature? It’s only a matter of time before the next “Shot heard around the world”…I hope I’m wrong…

  15. Paladin says

    Carrying a gun is not a threat of violence, and given the way police have violently treated protesters at the RNC and DNC protests in recent years, I can understand why someone would want to carry a gun to an event like this. It’s ridiculous to say that he is making some kind of statement by just carrying a gun along. He also hasn’t done or said anything that makes him seem dangerous. (I would hope that most Americans would be willing to violently bring down an oppressive dictator if one were in power).

    Jimmyboyo, there are strong constitutional reasons for the Supreme Court to uphold gun rights in interpreting, just as there were strong reasons to strike down sodomy laws.

    The media should do a better job covering the pros and cons of Obamacare rather than pretending like the 40-50% of Americans who are sceptical of it are just Astroturf and fake.

    As for the quote, the specific part he took was obviously harmless, and I’ve never heard anyone demonizing someone for quoting Jefferson before.

  16. Alex says

    “Coming to terms with the fact that someone you virulently disagree with is president is part of what being a US citizen is about–many of us managed to accomplish it during 2 Bush terms. They need to accept that Obama is president and act like mature citizens.”

    Are you kidding me? And how did you like those 8 years? Give me a break. The right to assembly and protest and express your disagreement with your government is the foundation of a healthy democracy. As long as these people are not breaking the law, you, nor MSNBC nor anyone here has a right to say they are wrong for doing what they are doing. You may no more agree with them than they do with Obama’s healthcare plan, but simply because you think you are right about an issue doesn’t mean these people have to sit down and shut up.

    Obama is president. The Dems control Congress. If they can’t grow a set and pass healthcare in light of strong public dissent to it, then that only demonstrates what everyone knows. Democrats are incompetent pussies. Great ideas but no balls to back it up. I’d certainly rather see them fail than compromise. Some half assed revision to the healthcare system will do nothing for anyone but increase taxes with nearly no results to show for it.

  17. paul c says

    “Coming to terms with the fact that someone you virulently disagree with is president is part of what being a US citizen is about–many of us managed to accomplish it during 2 Bush terms. They need to accept that Obama is president and act like mature citizens.”

    @Ernie – I agree completely! But Obama needs to realize that being President means that you are President of and for ALL of the people…not just for your party or your “base”…or your contributors.

    As President or Congressman, your job is to be a diplomat and to ensure peace and tranquility — not to dismiss, marginalize or slander half of the population — and certainly not to incite violence with insane and moronic phrases like “punch back twice as hard”. That is beyond idiotic.

    As you said, we had 8 years of incompetence and corruption under Bush, and it is becoming increasingly obvious that we are in for three and a half more.

    I also fear that what we will get next will be even worse — just as the pendulum swung from Bush’s idiocy of the right to the extreme leftist idiocy of Obama, it may very well swing back even further to the right and give us someone horrible like Huckabee for another 4-8 years of hell.

  18. paul c says

    “As for the quote, the specific part he took was obviously harmless, and I’ve never heard anyone demonizing someone for quoting Jefferson before.”

    @Paladin – Isn’t it frightening that you are now beginning to hear just that?

  19. says

    “It’s ridiculous to say that he is making some kind of statement by just carrying a gun along.”

    Of course he was making a statement. It is his right in the state of NH, and he exercised it. He wasn’t by some casual coincidence carrying a loaded weapon and a sign in close vicinity of a presidential town meeting. An angry citizen with a loaded weapon in a politically charged environment sure seems dangerous to me, but, you’re right, he wasn’t breaking the law. I’m not sure what you mean by: “I would hope that most Americans would be willing to violently bring down an oppressive dictator if one were in power.” Our presidents are freely elected. When would it be acceptable too “violently bring down” any elected official?

    And, Alex, I never suggested that anyone sit down and shut up. I’m a firm believer in free speech. I just happen to believe that informed, civil discourse is more useful than aimless anger. I also agree that it’s the responsibility of the Democrats to stand up to the opposition, make their case against the scare tactics, and pass legislation. If they screw up this opportunity, they’ll have themselves to blame.

  20. Attmay says

    Anyone who hates Obama, and some of the reasons for that hate are fully justified, would be stupid to try and kill him. It would make him a martyr. But then again, a few of Obama’s opponents happen to be too stupid to see that. That’s what the Secret Service is for.

  21. DJ says

    Paul C., what are you talking about. Obama has been nothing if not fair to those who disagree. He would have every right to condemn the threats, scare tactics and dangerous lies that are being spewed, but all he has done is listen and respond thoughtfully to those who disagree. Case in point, when an elderly woman asked him about the euthanasia at an AARP town hall a few weeks ago, he didn’t dismiss the question, he answered it and said it wasn’t true.

  22. Landis says

    If this was Georgie Dubya and a Democrat protester, you know the Dem protester would be labeled a terrorist.

    I think the NH man is a terrorist and should be sent to Gitmo.

  23. says

    I agree, DJ. If anything, the Democrats tend to be too slow to dismiss ludicrous ideas. (Not that there aren’t legitimate concerns about health care reform, but I don’t see Obama dismissing those either.) It’s a fine line between listening to genuine concerns and letting crackpots control a debate. The right-wing Republicans (not to be confused with the moderates of the party) are much more skilled at dismissing the opposition than the left-wing Democrats. The desperation comes when they still have the skills but not the power. But I never underestimate their knack for scaring the public.

    “Anyone who hates Obama, and some of the reasons for that hate are fully justified, would be stupid to try and kill him.”

    What exactly are the fully justified reasons for hating the president? Disagreement with his policies, yes, but hate? And wouldn’t someone be more than stupid to try to kill a president? Wouldn’t they also be, say, wrong?

  24. Lance says

    I get that this is messed up, but why is there no coverage of the actual town hall meeting itself? I feel like it would be more beneficial for people to hear what Obama had to say than to keep focusing only on the crazies.

  25. jimmyboyo says

    Lance

    MSNBC and CNN carried full coverage with Fox ending coverage when it appeared the questions were not contentious. The fox newscaster even said they would return to coverage of the town hall if there was yelling etc.

    AP even notcied the strangeness of that and has reported on Fox’s non reporting and choice of words of only returning to coverage if there was basicaly chaos

  26. Zach says

    It’s both interesting and frightening how fast lobbyist-induced violent thuggery has become an exercise of “rights”. A Democrat doing that in the Bush era would have either been shot on sight or held as a terrorist.

    If there’s one thing the Right excels at doing, it’s screaming (and I emphasize screaming, since it takes all of two minutes before a righty starts screaming) about rights while they’re busy trying to take away a swath of them from other folks.

  27. paul c says

    @Lance – Or even better to focus on Obama’s secret backroom deal with the pharmaceutical lobby…but that’s not what this site is about. This site is about promoting whatever poorly strategized propaganda message the Democrats want to put out at a given moment.

  28. paul c says

    “I think the NH man is a terrorist and should be sent to Gitmo.”

    @Landis – There is no more Gitmo. Remember, Obama closed that down right after ending the two wars and finally granting equal rights to gays…or was it right after he ended domestic spying? He’s kept so many promises, I get confused!!

  29. Attmay says

    “What exactly are the fully justified reasons for hating the president? Disagreement with his policies, yes, but hate?”

    Nothing justifies threats to his life, but let’s look at his accomplishments so far:

    —Making racist remarks about his own grandmother
    —Bringing a homophobic gospel “singer” on his South Carolina tour
    —Opposing gay marriage with his asinine “God is in the mix” statement
    —Lying about the nature of his relationship with Bill Ayers, an unrepentant Weather Underground terrorist who is only free because of a technicality, and falsely accusing those who pointed it out of accusing him of participating in the attacks
    —Campaign artwork inspired by art from the murderous dictatorship known as the USSR
    —Appointing a homophobic, anti-semitic preacher to give the invocation at his inauguration
    —Continuing corporate welfare
    —Unconstitutional government seizure of a privately owned corporation (if you loved the Trabant and the Yugo, you’ll love the “New, Improved” General Motors)
    —Sending a greeting video to Iran, a country where homosexuality is punishable by death
    —Being nicer to our enemies than our allies (I can’t tell which is which anymore)
    —Backtracking on DADT
    —Almost tripling the deficit
    —He said in 2003 he wanted a single-payer system, now he says he doesn’t. What changed him?

    I’m sure the list will be ten times this size by 2012. If it’s not, and the items on this list are rectified, good. It’s more likely that Jimmy Carter may end up looking good by that time.

    Not all of those by themselves are enough to justify hate, but together they paint the portrait of a cynical, self-serving, condescending bastard.

    But you all think that the criticism of him is really a ruse to veil critics’ alleged racism. This guy is a white nationalist and a Ron Paul supporter. Don’t assume he acts in the name of everyone who is disgusted with the Administration.

  30. robert says

    I agree with Derek. the history of guns bringing guns near presidents or presidential candidates is not a good one. as far at the supreme court is concerned until recently with roberts alioto and scalia he was right it was about the wording around militia. those darned activist judges again.

  31. Drew says

    Sane people don’t go and wear guns to social gatherings unless they’re NRA meetings.

    Was this an NRA meeting? No? Then WTF is nutcase doing with that gun at an Obama event? Ugh.

  32. Leonard Jones says

    God, some of these comments are plain ignorant. It’s amazing how some commenters have characterized gun owners as either NRA members or terrorists. I’ve never even shot a gun before and I can still recognize the importance of gun ownership in our government, so ignorance cannot be claimed for the large number of asinine comments and commenters.

    This man was only excerising a fundamental right, a right to “bear arms.” Sorry, to the commenter who thought his knowledge of the structure of our judicial system and of our founding document as a Towleroad commenter trumped that of our nation’s highest court and legal precedent, but the protestor has every right to arm himself, as long as the president is in no danger (or anyone else for that matter, as his background should’ve been investigated into when he applied for a permit) I don’t see what the uproar is about.

    The town hall meetings have been painted as failures because of the many outbreaks of dissent by those attending, but I’ve yet to see any significant violence erupt.

  33. says

    The Republican’s ONLY effort is obstruction. This is not healthy for democracy. Sickening.

    The shouting health care people and birthers are NOT marginalized. They are simply freaked that the president is black and wants progress.

    They love the socialism of social security, medicare, police, and fire protection, but they rant against Socialism. More neurons please.

  34. ohboy says

    unless this guy carrys a gun 24/7; this act was meant to intimidate and terrorize.

    does he carry a gun to the airport, sporting events, school, his workplace? or does he assume the position to the nanny state in those circumstances?

    would someone carrying a baseball bat, a can of gasoline, or a machette get the same ‘rights’ consideration?

  35. David in Houston says

    First of all, the protester in the video comes across as a certifiable nutjob… and why, exactly, did he need to bring a gun to a town hall meeting? Have there been robberies taking place or bear attacks? This falls under the category of “use common sense”. Hurray for the right to bear arms! I’m looking forward to shopping at Target with every customer walking around with a loaded weapon. I’d hate to be the cashier that doesn’t give grandma her 25¢ discount on adult diapers.

    Mark my words, the next time this happens it will be dozens of ‘nutjobs’ with their guns, and one of them is going to go off the deep end and scream something about ‘saving America’ and you and I know how it’s going to end.

  36. Ben says

    Let’s call the spade what it is.
    All these ‘protestors’ are one of 2 things: closet racists or stooges for the Republican astroturf operations. Or both. Please. It’s mostly old white people…who already fucking have government health care! Hello Medicare!

    I could not go to one of these meetings – I get so incensed thinking about all those old idiots in there bitching about health care reform when they ALREADY HAVE FUCKING GOVERNMENT HEALTH CARE that we younger generations are paying for via payroll tax deductions. I’d just have to start punching these old idiots. They are old racist white idiots in my book. Plain and simple. I’ve been dealing with it since before the 08 election – all my country folk 60+ family members made all these same accusations about Obama. When I called them on their unspoken race baiting…they’d just sit quietly, with no retort other than to get on my case for being smart.

    Ugh. Pathetic. Jesus would have told all these nuts to help their fellow man in need – not act like Pharisees and fools.

  37. says

    For anyone who has no issue with this, you’re a fucking idiot and I hope you turn your guns on yourselves to put us out of YOUR misery. No one except law enforcement/secret service should be allowed anywhere near a public official with a handgun, let alone some insane asshole wearing a Timothy McVeigh, homegrown-terrorist style T-shirt. Are you nuts?

    Alex, you’re a fucking troll. This isn’t about the right to assemble and protest and express disagreement. It’s a lunatic with a gun.

    People like him will not be happy until Obama is shot and killed, and then people like you—who is bitching at the inability of the weak Dems to push through their ideas with no compromises and yet who is whining that the poor guy with a gun should be left alone—will be partly to blame.

    You think Dems need to grow a pair? People like you who look the other way while radicals rev each other up for the kill need to grow a pair, identify them as what they are—potential killers—and fight them down instead of sniffing that the Dems are not strong enough.

  38. Attmay says

    “Troll” is nothing more than a hackneyed expression to attack anyone who’s not part of the echo chamber. Seriously, Matthew, a moderator/blogger calling for posters to commit suicide. This site has hit a new low.

    And David R., we do not fucking have a democracy. We have a republic. California has direct democracy in the form of those shitty propositions, and look how that turned out. So anything that’s not “healthy for democracy” is good for this country. And this bill is so bloated and poorly thought out that it needs to be obstructed until it can actually be, gee, I don’t know, thought the fuck through. But the bill doesn’t even need a single GOP supporter to pass anyway. The filibuster is long gone.

  39. g_whiz says

    Someone with loaded openly displayed weapon on one’s hip waving a sign that says “Its time to water the tree of liberty” (which is referencing violent revolt, vis a vis bloodshed) is making a very obvious threat. Of course, that interview tells me his platform isn’t much to stand on. I would have just as soon done without giving him a voice when he had nothing relevant to say regarding the issue at hand.

  40. mike says

    I am proud of this dude. Telling the MR Obama dictator and chief that he is standing up for his rights. He was in no way shape or form breaking the law. I find it funny that they could not touch the him. We should all stand up for or rights why we still can.

  41. nicholas says

    I almost spat out my breakfast when he said “…I’m not advocating violence, I’m advocating an informed armed and polite society”. Society can’t be that informed or polite if you need to bear arms dude!

    So if he walked into a school carrying his armed informed polite attitude and let’s not forget the gun, it’s still legal?

    Jesus fucking Christ, sometimes the US right wing nutjobs really scare me. Isn’t the 2nd:

    “The people have a right to bear arms for the defense of themselves and their own state, or the United States, or the purpose of killing game; and no law shall be passed for disarming the people or any of them, unless for crimes committed…”

    Just what was he defending?

  42. Contrarian says

    I am from an older demographic and I’m white,so let me comment on the attitudes and actions of these disruptive individuals. People whose world-view is formed by radio entertainers(Limbaugh, Beck et.al whose only qualification is that they are failed top 40 D.J.’s) do not deserve our understanding or sympathy for their “fears”. Willful ignorance which is self-imposed does not warrant our concerns.
    I also strongly suspect that the alleged gay GOPers leaving comments are nothing of the sort and are plants pretending to be LGBT.. At my age I remember Nixon and the plumbers and the Republicans are masters of tricks and deceit. The Ron Paul fan with the gun in N.H.looks all too eerily like Oswald to me, and I lived through that horrible day. Any LGBT Republican on here is the equivalent of the Jew who led his own kind into the cattle cars to Auschwitz.

  43. says

    New Hampshire is an “Open carry state.” This means you don’t need a permit to carry your pistol openly. You do need one to carry concealed. All but about 6 states allow open carry in one form or another. And as hard as it is to believe, Texas does NOT allow open carry, with or without a permit, except on your own property.

    I live in Michigan, we have open carry here also. But I also have a concealed pistol license, which allows me to carry concealed OR openly, as I desire. Some claim that the “element of surprise” is a greater defence than open carry.

    Let me tell you, I have fewer confrontations when I carry openly, than when I carry concealed.

    We have several mottos in the Pink Pistols. The one I like best is, “Armed Gays don’t get bashed.”

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