Comments

  1. Brad says

    Normally I agree with Cenk Uygur all the way. However I take a little exception. Let me say I did not vote Repug this last election, nor will I ever, but we have more than two choices. The two party system is broken. Repugs hate us, but the Democrats are not showing much friendship either. Democrats like Obama give pretty speeches about LGBT civil-rights but when it comes time to deliver they drop the ball. They’ve been doing it for a long time. As the both parties move more and more to the right, neither supports my views. I’m never voting for the R’s but that doesn’t mean I’ll automatically vote for the D’s either. My message to politicians: You play politics with my civil-rights, my relationships, my very life and you lose my vote and you lose your job. If the Democrats want my time, money or vote they have to earn it.

  2. David says

    He’s right, I agree entirely with him. I am one of those gays who supports the Iraq war and broadly support the foreign policy of the neoconservatives. But Cenk is right that my belief in interventionism is trumped by the fact that I am gay and the Republicans want to make my life, and the lives of all gay Americans, as difficult as possible and that is unacceptable and it’s why I’ll never vote for them. The Democrats aren’t great, either, that’s for sure. But they’re not actively campaigning against us, and that’s kind of the best we can hope for at the moment.

  3. Henry Holland says

    Cenk, they get it. They just don’t give a damn, as long as the Republicans promise them tax cuts, they’ll vote (R). That’s all that matters, saving a few hundred dollars a year on property taxes.

    “The two party system is broken”

    And it will remain that way unless there’s a voter revolt that demands changes to the way we vote. There’s no incentive for R or D to change the system, it works perfectly for them, so things like Instant Runoff Voting won’t happen any time soon.

  4. BobN says

    This completely misses the point. Support for repeal of DADT among REPUBLICANS is 56%.

    The opposition isn’t because the GOP “isn’t that into us”. It’s worse than that. It’s a willingness to EXPLOIT homophobia and punish gay service members.

  5. Gregoire says

    Personal monetary greed trumps freedom and equality for most gay republicans and they will admit that. They see it as a slow road with the Democrats, so they choose a closed road with the Republicans. It might be a road to nowhere, but at least theyre financially comfortable.

  6. StillMarriedinCalifornia says

    Cenk’s right. When I read those statistics, I shook my head in disbelief. It’s one thing to be pissed at the Democrats for not doing enough/what they promised but it’s quite another to actually cast a vote for the party that HATES you. Who are these 31 percent of LGBTs who vote Republican and how stupid can they be?

  7. LincolnLounger says

    Painting with a broad brush is stupid. We hate it when people act as though all gay men are nelly queens or Chelsea boys, etc. Yet, too many of you presume all Republicans are evil.

    If Democrats were our saviors, perhaps they might have accomplished something when our “Fierce Advocate” had veto-proof majorities. I guess that means that not all Democrats are our friends, just like all Republicans are not our enemy.

    We need gay Republicans speaking up in the party. It’s good for everybody.

  8. StillMarriedinCalifornia says

    Ok, Lincoln Lounger, then please explain how not ONE Republican Senator voted for the repeal of DADT while nearly every Democrat did. How in virtually every instance in every level of government in every state, the only party who is voting for, let alone introducing, pro-gay legislation is the Democratic Party. How there are many instances of anti-gay platforms in the Republican party (The recent Texas Republican embarrassment comes immediately to mind) yet there are no anti-gay platforms (quite the contrary) on the Democrats side. Saying there are exceptions in the Republican party is not enough. The party stands for anti-gay hatred at every turn.

  9. says

    Still Married in California, the reason is the Democrats did not allow them to propose amendments and that is why some of our Republican allies voted against DADT repeal, because DADT repeal was linked with the DREAM act.
    Reid should of just putted a vote w/o the DREAM act and see what Republican support would of happened.

  10. K in VA says

    For all their promises to the contrary, Democrats are rarely our staunch friends — but Republicans are always our enemies.

    So, I say: Vote Democratic — you may not move forward, but at least you won’t go backwards.

  11. BartB says

    Americans, usually goaded by politicians, need a boogie man. There needs to be an enemy. Back in the 60s it was first the blacks, who wanted equal rights and then in the late 60s, the Commies. They were going to blow up America. We hated them. 70s it was the North Vietnamese AND the hippies. Hated those hippies…they were promoting free sex (Americans as a whole are terrified of sex and sexuality but not sexualization of young women and to a lesser extend young men…we love that) drugs, and communal respect and love. In the 80s, the wall came down and the war was over and we as a country searched and searched for a new enemy…we tried a lot of them on, like shirts at Macy’s. But like most shirts from Macy’s eventually we just left them hanging in the closet. Then in the 90s hating the Muslims — and by proxy all Middle Eastern people began to take shape. And as gay men and women started oozing out of the overflowing closets and the memory of Stonewall and the Castro riots weren’t going away, gay men and women became an enemy…basically because we wouldn’t shut up and crawl back into the shadows.

    Enemies up until this time were in three seperate catagories: geo-political, religious, or cultural. But in the 2000s America started finding fashion with hating Muslims as a political/religious enemy and gay men and women as religious/cultural enemies (the one constant being RELIGION.) And we are still living that hatred today, especially as the Republican party has sold it’s soul to neo-Christians and asshat Tea Party people who believe that Jesus was born white and was wrapped in an American flag while laying in the manger…somewhere in Oklahoma.

    I imagine in 20 years, that hating gays will be passe. it’ll be a hard 20 years but the more exposure to gay men and women each generation is, the less fear they have and the less ignorant they behave.

    And America will be onto a new enemy. Because we as a nation cannot seem to survive without someone to hate.

  12. says

    “Cenk Uygur’s Message for Gay Republicans — the GOP Just Isn’t That Into You”

    Here’s a clue, Cenk: Neither are the Democrats. They’re just into our money and our votes. They don’t really give a shit about US, and certainly not our civil rights.

    And seriously, this fuck is lecturing us? the same Cenk who said he couldn’t be bothered with respecting the wishes of gays who don’t want to be called “homosexual”?

    http://www.bilerico.com/2010/09/young_turks_ill_call_you_people_what_i_want.php

    GO FUCK YOURSELF CENK, we’re just not that into YOU.

  13. says

    and furthermore, why the fuck is he lecturing US???? 70-30 is pretty damn impressive for a dem constituency. How about he go lecture women, or young voters, or some other group who voted in greater numbers for the GOP. This is just more of the scapegoating and proliferation of the meme that “the gays” cost the dems the election.

  14. Brad says

    Lincolnlounger. Thank you! We struggle against stereotypes every day and yet are so quick to stereotype half the country as stupid, evil and enemies. True, most enemies of LGBT initiatives are repubs. But that doesn’t mean they are all like that. I know some wonderful people who are republican for many political and economic reasons, but are furious that the party is putting so much energy into forcing their moral superiority on the country.

    Still, can’t help but agree with the clip. I am not strictly democrat by ideology, but find it hard to justify voting for a party that is officially against my way of life, who I am. I feel that I have to vote democrat just because they aren’t overtly trying to ignorantly thwart my personal wellbeing and happiness.

  15. says

    “you may not move forward, but at least you won’t go backwards.”

    except when we do, of course. Like bringing back DADT from the dead. But even if it were true, you sure do set the bar low for yourself. Sounds like a campaign slogan for eyore.

  16. StillMarriedinCalifornia says

    @Matt–that’s sort of an excuse for DADT, I guess, but what about the rest of what I wrote? It’s not difficult to figure out who to vote for when something like 90 percent or more of Democrats are on your side (at least in words– cold comfort, I know) while the number of Republicans on your side can fit on the head of pin. And the complete and utter disappointment that we feel in the Dems not living up to their promises is certainly valid–and needs to be addressed–but the fact remains; when the election is between a candidate from one party that champions your rights and a candidate from another party that actively works AGAINST your rights (and a third party doesn’t have a chance in hell); why is there any question who to vote for? The way to punish a Democrat who doesn’t actively work for our equality is to replace him with another Democrat who DOES–not to vote in a Republican Hater out of spite.

  17. mike says

    @BRAD I agree with you totally. But, it brings up a sense that both parties are worthless to LGBT people. To paraphrase John Nance Garner, FDR’s first vice president: “Neither party is worth a bucket of warm piss”.

    @GREGOIRE I’d rather be poor, free with full civil equality than rich but always on the outside looking in. It’s the half-full/half-empty syndrome: I vote Democratic, at least my cup is half-full; I vote republicon, my cup is always half-empty.

    A pox on both parties’ houses.

  18. Randy says

    @Gaylib: The dems just want to be acquantances while the repubs pick on us and steal our lunch money while their friends “average joes” sit by and laugh.

    He’s right in that the republicans are actively against us. Your statement that the dems just want our votes/money is just as telling. The repubs turn DOWN our money and they use us to get votes from other people. They don’t want our votes. They only want us alive so that we can help scare religious people into voting for them.

  19. says

    Randy, I’m not suggesting republicans are any better. Just don’t fool yourselves into thinking the dems give a rats ass about you. Every individual running for office will have to earn my vote, regardless of their party. If they support gay civil rights, I will support them, if the don’t, I won’t. And since Dems have a history of making big promises only to distance themselves once elected, I will also only vote for politicians with a proven track record of fighting for equality. promises don’t mean shit, especially when the leader of the party is a serial liar.

  20. Henry Holland says

    “He is so wrong on one point “Republican DO want to kill gays” they would want nothing better then to get rid of us all, once and for all…”

    Nah, not buying that. The evangelicals who are going to be Raptured any time now so they can be with Jesus, sure they’d like to smite us, but the part of the Republican party that uses the Bible thumpers like the Dems use GLBTTQI doesn’t really give a shit about gays except as a wedge issue, they just want to make sure they don’t have to pay taxes and there’s no regulations or oversight on businesses.

  21. JimSur212 says

    Many of these comments are so inane. The Democrats have passed the repeal in the House. We need 60 votes in the Senate and we have 54 to 56 of the 58 Democrats. How many Republicans do we have right now? ZERO. May I say that again? Z E R O !!! That’s right, Z E R O!!! Did you get that? Z E R O!!! The gay community does not have a Democratic problem, we have a Republican problem. I’ll change my mind when Scott Brown, Olympia Snowe and Susan Collins agree to vote for repeal in the lame duck session. Until then… I would suggest that the Dem bashers refrain from attacking the only friends we have.

  22. Jose says

    He’s wrong. I did have other choices and I chose them. I researched every single candidate for each office and I voted a completely mixed ticket – mostly Greens and Libertarians, some Democrats, and even one Republican. After 32 years as a Democrat, I am done forever assuming that the Democratic party has my interests at heart. If the last 2 years have shown us anything, it is that the Democrats feel that they are entitled to the LGBT vote and donations, but they don’t feel like they have to do anything to earn them.

    Well, sorry, if my choices are between open homophobes and closet homophobes, if both of my choices are evil, as Cenk says, if my equality is not going to be advanced no matter which of the 2 major parties is in power, then I guess I’ll just cast my protest votes and hey, maybe with the Republicans I’ll at least get a tax break.

  23. Tim says

    This post and many of the comments display many of the reasons exactly why gay people would vote for the Republicans.

    I vote for the Republican locally because he was a man I knew personally. I discussed my homosexuality with him before working on his campaign. He is a man who spent over 40 years as a local principal and 10 years as a business owner. I’m not “stupid”, “hateful”, “self-hating” or any of the above labels because I vote for a man who is my neighbor who’s worked his whole life to benefit his community.

    The reality is gay people who identify themselves solely as gay in all their political interactions and ideas are very one sided and will continually be disappointed by politics. Americans currently pay 40-70% of their incomes to various governmental agencies of which we get very little back from. Does believing in gay rights also mean that we put our faith in government to provide all for us? Does it mean we rely on government to take our money by force instead of choosing which charities to give to? Does it mean we’re automatically in favor of abortion, against the death penalty, or believe that viewpoints other than our own can be censored by the government? Does it mean that we automatically believe in more intrusion in our lives, or that we believe one way or another as far as war or international policy is concerned? If you really think being gay means all your opinions on a whole host of other issues is completely irrelevant to your lives, you are very narrow minded and mistaken. Does it matter if I can get married if Iran is throwing nuclear bombs towards my neighborhood? Does it matter if I can get married if I can’t find a job or keep enough of my earnings to pay for a wedding?

    Media outlets including this and the above video should really stop treating gays and other minorities as if they are one dimensional beings without the ability to think outside their own minority status.

    Just even the tenor of those on the left would make me embarrassed to be a part. The left is by far the leader in shutting down dissenting voices, attacking people on personal levels, resorting to name calling before ideas, and a host of other dirty political tricks. As long as gay people continue to name call their opponents instead of trying to change their minds, they will always be dependent on a political party that will never have balls or power to advance their interest.

    While some Republicans do use their religion to advance antigay views, others who are more libertarian minded do not, and the Republican Party has enough breadth and depth to it to include people of differing beliefs, just like the Democratic party. Personally, I’d rather vote for someone who disagrees with me, but will actually have a discussion and be honest about their objections than a whole party of Democrats who talks out of their ass about supporting gay rights and never takes action. For all those thinking the right has been the exclusive enemy of gay rights, both Obama and HRC are still opponents of gay marriage, and President Clinton was the one who happily signed both DOMA and DADT with a smile on his face. What’s worse, being honest about your disagreements, or lying about them and doing the opposite once you’re in power?

  24. says

    “He’s wrong on another point. Democrats don’t like us either.”

    Speak for yourself. The Democrats I voted for this past election like me just fine. All of them support repeal of DADT, passage of ENDA, and getting rid of DOMA. My Democratic governor was instrumental in passing marriage equality in my state. Leadership and political will may be lacking in the administration, but I plan to keep my pro-gay Dem’s in office, thank you very much.

  25. says

    “Does it matter if I can get married if I can’t find a job or keep enough of my earnings to pay for a wedding?”

    Umm … YES. The right to marry will always trump how nice your wedding party is.

    Idiot.

  26. Henry Holland says

    “Americans currently pay 40-70% of their incomes to various governmental agencies of which we get very little back from”

    That’s simply not true. I just spent 5 minutes Googling and it’s more like 28-30% (in the bottom half of Western nations) and if you’re in the upper tax brackets, it’s less because of tax breaks and shelters. A good chunk of our taxes go to pay for our bloated and insane military budget, not the hobgoblins you imagine.

    “Does it matter if I can get married if Iran is throwing nuclear bombs towards my neighborhood?”

    Oh for fuck’s sake.

    1. Iran is years away from acquiring nuclear weapons capability and good for them for doing so, it’s probably the only thing that’s going to prevent an invasion under bullshit pretexts by America, an invasion that the US government has been planning and itching for since the late 70’s. FACT.

    You know, maybe if the US and Britain hadn’t overthrown their democratically elected leader in 1953 because he wanted to nationalize the Iranian oil industry (= no BP/American ownership) and installed the brutal Shah, then supported Iraq for 8 years in the ghastly Iraq/Iran war –you know, Saddam’s Iraq, that guy, the guy the US propped up for 40 years until he outlived his usefulness?– maybe they wouldn’t think that we’re going to fuck them royally again given the chance.

    2. We have 5,000 nuclear weapons ready to fire now and about 5,000 more that can be online in a matter of days. We can turn Iran to glass in 6 seconds. You think they don’t know that? You think they’re ignorant of what happened in Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

    I’ll say this as nicely as I can because FSM forbid I come across as a shrill lefty, but your claim has about as much validity as Tony Blair’s completely discredited claim that Saddam “can launch a nuclear or chemical attack in 45 minutes” did.

    I’d fisk the rest of your post but the Kings game is starting up again.

  27. StillMarriedinCalifornia says

    Thank you Henry. Tim IS stupid and self-hating, but he is too stupid to realize that.

    This was my favorite “The left is by far the leader in shutting down dissenting voices, attacking people on personal levels, resorting to name calling before ideas, and a host of other dirty political tricks.”

    oh, really? Are you sure you aren’t confusing the left with the right? The Valerie Plame case is just a start…then there is the incessant name calling and personal attacks on Obama and Pelosi…they called Barney Frank some choice names…. and the Tea Party rallies are nothing BUT name calling without ideas.
    Tim, do you have any connection to reality?

  28. Tim says

    Actually the average American works well into April/May or longer just to pay their tax burden to various local,state and federal agencies. And that’s not counting taxes on gasoline, license plates for cars, property taxes on houses, taxes on lights, taxes on water, taxes on television, phone, internet, tolls to drive, sales taxes, luxury taxes such as on hotels and vacations, flying in airplanes, Social Security and FICA taxes, to go down a few. But you googled for 5 minutes and proved me wrong! Why would an entrepeneur even want to start a business and be successful. Hard work now just rewards you with less of your own money to hand out to people without jobs. And after spending your life giving half your income to the government, when you die the government wants half of what you have left. So you work hard and in the end keep less than 25% of what you’ve earned total?

    The point about Iran was a point on foreign policy, sorry if you took it so literal. ie maybe things like Islamic states acquiring nuclear arms and us pumping billions in foreign aid to countries that don’t like us and think we’re satan might also be an issue that gay rights doesn’t automatically mean you take a side on.

    Thanks for showing how you don’t use name calling and shrill attacks by calling me stupid and self-hating. Real winner on that argument!

    I’m sorry, last I checked it wasn’t the right trying to entirely get rid of talk radio, black list climate scientists and academics who speak out against leftists, and creating speech codes. Maybe you should actually go to a tea party rally. Somehow this year the racist, bigoted tea party elected more women, blacks, hispanics and other minorities than have ever served in Congress before (see Rubio, West, Bachman, etc) Go ask Allen West how racist the tea party is, instead of relying on the oddly white consortium of Olbermann, Matthews, Maddow, Stewart, Colbert and Huffington for your analysis of the status of race relations and tea party members.

    Republicans are going to have a lot of power due to the giant fuck up the Dems have been. I’d advise HRC and others to learn to have conversations with those they disagree with politically instead of being shrill attack artists in the hopes another Great Depression will come along and con the American people into voting Dems back into power and hoping maybe the SECOND time they have 60 seats in the Senate, control of Congress and the Presidency they might give a shit about gays… If any of us are still alive then…

  29. Randy says

    The bottom line is that the only way Democrats will be forced to act on equality is if they pay a price (i.e. lose an election) when they don’t do it. The position of Republicans is mostly irrelevant, unless they realize they may want to keep that 31% who voted for them this time.

  30. boneil says

    I’d like to know where they are getting the numbers on what percentage of us are voting for which party. I vote in every election, and no one has ever asked me which party I voted for or whether I am a gay. If anyone ever did, I would gladly tell them.
    Aside from that, I am in total agreement. No matter how you feel about the Democrats, there is absolutely no excuse for voting Republican. If the GOP ever does a complete about face, stops pandering to Christian conservatives, reaches out to the gay community, and actively starts working to promote gay civil rights, or when hell freezes over, whichever happens first, then, and only then will I begin to consider voting Republican.

  31. Henry Holland says

    “But you googled for 5 minutes and proved me wrong!”

    I specifically looked for numbers on TOTAL tax burden, so yes, as far as I can tell I proved you wrong. Show me data from reputable sources that show otherwise and I’ll admit I’m wrong. Who am I kidding though? You aren’t interested in facts.

    The Socialist taxation hell that’s in your head has no basis in reality. The US is in the lower half of industrialized nations when it comes to taxation and the wealthy pay a pitiful amount of that.

    “Hard work now just rewards you with less of your own money to hand out to people without jobs”

    And there we have it, classic wingnut boilerplate. It always leaks out in the end.

    “And after spending your life giving half your income to the government”

    Repeating a lie over and over doesn’t make it true.

    “maybe things like Islamic states acquiring nuclear arms and us pumping billions in foreign aid to countries that don’t like us and think we’re satan”

    I’m surprised you didn’t type “Because they hate us for our freedoms”.

    “might also be an issue that gay rights doesn’t automatically mean you take a side on”

    Where was I taking sides on that because I’m gay? Again, if I’m being charitable, you wrote something that is simply not true (less charitable? you lied) about Iran –that they are an existential threat to the US– I wasn’t addressing whether it was relevant to gay issues at all.

    You seem to have a tenuous relationship with facts, or more accurately, you sound like a garden variety Limbaugh listener (it doesn’t matter if you listen to him or not), so your whole “Well, I’d be more sympathetic to the Dems if they and their followers weren’t so mean!” routine rings totally false.

    “Thanks for showing how you don’t use name calling and shrill attacks by calling me stupid and self-hating. Real winner on that argument!”

    That was Anon and StillMarried, not me. Reading comprehension, you might want to learn it.

  32. George M says

    Tim, do you really think you can turn some of those Republicans around by talking to them? Is this something you’ve done or seen done, im just asking because i’ll tell ya, most are set in their ways. They have no reason to change, it does nothing for them. I guess I don’t understand why you vote Republican, but thats just me, I’ve always had that problem. I don’t mean for it to sound hard or hatefull i just don’t get it.

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