Florida Pastor Arrested Soliciting Sex from Men in Park

A Florida pastor was among those arrested this week in a sex sting in a public park:

ClarkPolk County Sheriff's Office vice detectives arrested four men, including a pastor and a retired Canadian police officer, during an undercover operation today at Peace River Park in the Homeland area. Detectives said after they made contact with the men, the suspects exposed themselves and/or asked them to perform sex acts on them. Among those arrested was Matthew Preston Clark, 33, of Bartow, who told detectives he is senior pastor at the Blessed Assurance Temple, 1245 S. McAdoo Ave, Bartow. He was charged with soliciting a lewd act.

"It never ceases to amaze me when professionals such as preachers and law enforcement officers are engaged in such outrageous behavior," Sheriff Grady Judd said in a release. "That type of behavior is not going to be tolerated in our parks. We want to ensure that all of our parks are safe for children and their families to enjoy. "

Families like Pastor Clark's?

Comments

  1. Sam says

    “That type of behavior is not going to be tolerated in our parks. We want to ensure that all of our parks are safe for children and their families to enjoy.” Unless that type of behavior is being performed by one man and one woman. Then they don’t have a problem with it.

  2. says

    one of the many benefits of being comfortable with one’s self, and being supported by others as a gay man, is that we don’t have to sneak around hoping to get man-on-man action in places like this -risking fear of being caught.

    hey guys, nobody’s gonna arrest you for going on a date with another dude and then going to back to your place to get laid.

  3. Joey Y says

    @tom, blur out what? That’s the church’s website.

    @sam, straw-man much? Sorry, but in general straight people don’t “cruise” parks and store bathrooms and have sex with strangers out in the woods like feral dogs. Most gay people don’t, either, and I wouldn’t want to see it if I was in the park with my boyfriend either. It’s disgusting.

  4. Nat says

    “Unless that type of behavior is being performed by one man and one woman. Then they don’t have a problem with it.”

    The police regularly use similar tactics to arrest Johns.

    I’m know there are straight couples that will engage in public sex, but it’s not nearly as frequent as with men cruising for other men.

    I take issue with the police tactics involved in these mass arrests, but if you’re having sex in a public place, you have to be prepared to accept the proportionate consequences.

  5. Jack says

    1) Sex in public parks is not ok

    2) For once I agree with Kiwi. There’s no need for this behavior anymore. There is this thing called the internet. You’ll be able to find all the gratuitous sex you need there, without risking arrest.

    I don’t feel sorry for anyone busted in these stings.

  6. David says

    Although I’m always glad to see a hypocrite exposed, I loathe this kind of entrapment. Detectives “made contact” with the men? They cruised these men. They initiated the sexual behavior. That disgusts me. I’d bet that hypocritical troll could wander the woods for days without getting any legitimate action. Using police resources for this nonsense is the real crime here.

  7. Rick says

    Are those of you applauding these arrests so incredibly, mind-bogglingly naive that you don’t realize that the police who do this sort of thing are almost always acting out of homophobic motives? What the sheriff in this instance referred to “outrageous behavior,” he certainly was referring to sex between men–regardless of where it takes place–not to sex in a public place.

    Get real!

    And, by the way, being a pastor does not automatically make one a hypocrite and a homophobe, any more than being married and having sex with guys on the side does (ever heard of bisexuality?….oh, that’s right, all bisexuals are just gay and won’t admit it or accept it, right? Sheesh.)

  8. KP says

    The entrapment bugs me but I am also not a big fan of cruising in the park. I remember seeing a chart of the age groups who were arrested in one town in Florida (Palm Springs maybe?). There were a handful of 20 and 30 year olds while the majority were over the age of 40. To me, this can be intrepreted that many of the crusiers are likely closeted or even married. Like Little Kiwi said, there is really no reason for an openly gay man to cruise a park. Gays cruised in the 60s and 70s because there was no place else to go. Now there are tons of gay bars, parties, and hookup sites. There really is no need to hookup anymore in a park bathroom.

  9. says

    while vice-squad entrapments are ugly and prejudicial, the reality is this: if these men spent have as much time working on overcoming their insecurities about being gay as they spend on trying to secretly get their cock sucked they wouldn’t be in any trouble.

    stop trying to find secret ways to get cock. deal with your sexuality. work on it. embrace it. address it. then be a real adult and go out and your new concern will be “does that guy like me?” and not “is the guy at that urinal an undercover cop?”

    for real.

  10. BEAHBEAH says

    Everytime Andy posts on some kind of sting in a public park, I am constantly astounded by the number of people trying to defend these gay men.

    Stop having sex in public! Entrapment or not, gay men are not the only victims of sex stings. You want equality, well boys, you got it. Stop breaking the law and then claiming homophobia because you get caught.

  11. says

    By publishing the pastor’s name and picture, you hurt gay people in legitimizing the behavior of the cops. So what if you think he is a hypoctire! So do the homophobes! Thanks TR.

  12. Brian in Texas says

    He was just out there looking for souls to save. : )

    I feel sorry for this guy though that he felt he couldn’t live an out happy life as a gay or bi-sexual man. Maybe he “needed” to get caught and this will be the start of his honest and better life.

  13. jakeinlove says

    Wow. Judgmental group here. If people didn’t have sex in parks, meaning nor right smack dab in the middle of everyone, but at “make out spots” and discreet areas a good portion of you squeamish queens wouldn’t even be on the planet.

    Granted it’s not ideal, but yes it happens. I think Rick is more concerned in the aspect of the people conducting the sting in being the first to make a move in order to get a response and thus turning tables and saying they were propositioned.

  14. Wavin' Dave says

    The Polk County FL Sheriff is a major publicity whore, he’s in front of cameras more than Madonna. He’s slightly to the right of Mussolini.
    I am seriously considering become a pastor myself, though. At first it was gonna be “The Church of Prompt Succor.” Now it’ll be called “The Church of Prompt SUCKER” and we’ll picnic in the park!

  15. Ted says

    Apart from the many issues raised by this article, it is not illegal to solicit sexual activity from another consenting adult, unless the police can prove that it was to have sex there, or else was for money. Otherwise, asking another person to engage in sexual activity is protected speech.

  16. Ricco says

    Ordinarily I agree with, and enjoy KIWI’s rather eloquent comments, this being the first time I find myself dissenting.

    While it may be true, and seeming true to KIWI, and sundry, that sexcapades in our parks, our sand dunes, and national forests are no longer necessary perhaps things are not so crystal clear to those men still living closeted lives, who could never imagine the carefree gay world KIWI, and sundry, describe, where gay men are not assaulted and murdered as they come out with their dates from those public restaurants, bars, and ball parks, where children are not bullied to death, where gay men and women, far from being stigmatized, are afforded the respect of their countrymen, marrying and divorcing, as they please, in all fifty states, who contrary to KIWIS Utopia still feel compelled to covertly frequent parks and rest areas. Things are only starting to get better, but equality is still a VERY long way off.

    “One of the many benefits of being comfortable with one’s self, and being supported by others as a gay man, is that we don’t have to sneak around hoping to get man-on-man action in places like this, risking fear of being caught,” writes KIWI . . . the operative word being “comfortable.” Perhaps not everyone is as comfortable as KIWI with their sexuality, and being open in this brave new world of KIWI’s, but I am wondering where is the support for these men touted by KIWI? Or is that support reserved only for those living outside the closet, or who conduct themselves according to KIWI’s rule book for gay men?

    Putting all that aside, looking back to my own time beating the bushes by the river in Reno, the dunes in North Carolina’s Myrtle Beach, or the majestic forest in Vancouver’s Stanley Park, I never saw an extended family, brothers, sisters, mums and daddums, uncles and aunts, and lecherous cousins with incestuous leanings kicking or tossing a ball around, not even a nuclear unit, a mother, father, with a little girl, a little boy, and something in the oven. These activities were often conducted in the dead of night, when all the heterosexual people were tucked safely in bed with hegemonic visions floating in their heads. And those places where we played and cavorted freely, frolicking happily under God’s bright sun, was done in more remote and exotic places, again far from the sounds of bickering children, and scolding mothers, SO how exactly are these nocturnal gays endangering the parks and the families who play there?

    I am surprised that KIWI, usually discerning, and more subtle in thought, has chosen to criticize and pass judgment on these men, rather than attack the persecution by the police of gay men, and the obvious homophobia that is behind these stings. I am quite certain if the police had attractive women approach, and seduce men in the park those men would conduct themselves similarly to gay men seduced by hot policemen.
    The word “sting” itself implies a covert operation looking to infiltrate other covert operations or activities. I am always hearing how little man power the police have to investigate serious crimes, such as . . . oh, just off the top of my head, the enslavement and prostitution of children, and they think the best use of their limited resources is to go after consenting adults in remote places in the dead of night?

    What, but homophobia, could possibly motivate such a wanton waste of manpower, and seek to destroy the lives of men for not being straight? Maybe this wonderful new world is not quite the Utopia KIWI has made it out to be . . . because one thing is certain, these men’s lives would not be destroyed if they were found in the park with a woman.

    KIWI . . . it saddens, and disappoints me a little, that you have fallen drastically short of your usual thoughtful postings, engaging instead in the mundane babbling of the gay guilty man, overly concerned with what a homophobic straight society thinks, and finds himself embarrassed by the behavior of other gay men who are not as evolved as you.

  17. Bill says

    Why is intimacy disgusting? There seem to be a lot of prudes taking a moral high ground (oh yes, the CHILDREN must be protected). It must feel gratifying to shake your head disapprovingly at these closeted men who cruise parks. Gosh it almost makes one feel part of the straight world, doesn’t it! “Don’t hate us, we’re disgusted too!”

    What a comfortable and cowardly place to be – bully for you.

  18. Ricco says

    It took me awhile to write my last posting, and read over additional postings made by KIWI in the interim.

    Politically, KIWI says a lot of things with which I agree . . . I am sorry to see such a drastic philosophical departure in the compassionate treatment of his fellowman. I have to wonder how someone can talk about gay men supporting gay men, yet be so unsupportive and judgmental.

    Writes KIWI: stop trying to find secret ways to get cock. deal with your sexuality. work on it. embrace it. address it. then be a real adult and go out and your new concern will be “does that guy like me?” and not “is the guy at that urinal an undercover cop?”

    WOW!! Spoken as plainly as a judgmental fundamentalist Christian lacking in utter empathy.

  19. Modern Meet says

    In the Netherlands, some public parks have signs indicating designated gay cruising areas. So, families with children or other folks who are not interested in gay cruising/sex do not have to be concerned. Also, in Massachusetts, I believe, cruising and sex in public parks is permitted when participants are not visible to others. More, back in the day, San Francisco City Supervisors declared that people having sex in Buena Vista Park should be in the “privacy of their own bush.” Clearly, entrapment could be the case if the police crawling on their bellies through the brambles catch guys going at it when those participants thought themselves to be unseen.

  20. Ricco says

    Bravo BILL. It is like those Black people in the late 19th and early 20th century calling each other the “N” word because they felt certain Blacks made them look bad to White folks.

    Indeed! How brave of gay people to attack and vilify other gay people just to fit in with straight people.

  21. Joey Y says

    Give it a rest. Not wanting to see people have sex in a public park is FAR from prudish. Want to get laid? Go online and find someone. Want to be watched? Set it up. Don’t hand me some nonsense about “intimacy is a beautiful thing” because I have enough respect for MY relationship’s intimacy to actually KEEP it intimate. I shouldn’t under ANY circumstance have to watch ANYONE having any sexual contact unless I choose to. Also, it’s only entrapment if these men are coerced. Are you seriously arguing that gay men jave so little self-control that they just have to suck any cock they are near?

  22. Hollywood, Ca says

    Maybe people wouldn’t feel so f’ng ashamed of themselves if homophobia wasn’t so rampant in this country! You want people to stop having sex in bushes and in filthy bathrooms, let the gays have equal rights. Then, people can come out and stop pretending to be straight while “cruising” in such dangerous areas.

  23. Hollywood, Ca says

    And unlike some of the comments above, I do feel sorry for these people. I remember going to such dangerous places because I felt like there was no other option… it’s sad.

  24. Caliban says

    Have there been studies done about the percentage of people (men) caught in these restroom/park stings who are married or identify as “straight”? Yes some gay people do it too but based on my reading of many articles like this my sense of it is most of them are closeted men. Regarding the “maybe they’re bisexual” defense, maybe so but I doubt their wives are aware of that fact and they deserve at least an idea of what their partner is up to so they can make informed decisions about their marriage and their health.

    The police DO use entrapment to catch these guys. As Dan Savage said about the Larry Craig arrest, everything that happened would have passed beneath the notice of other people in that restroom because it depended on subtle clues (the tapping of feet, etc.) which only progressed BECAUSE the cop responded to them. That doesn’t mean it’s right or proper, only that much of the fear-mongering by police and the media over it is over-blown. They don’t cruise in the playground and no one is getting blown on the see-saw! If a man is blown in the forest and no one other than the participants is there to see/hear it, who gives a $#!t?!

    I wonder if this paper also prints the names, jobs, and addresses of those caught soliciting prostitutes? If not this report IS homophobic and intended for public shaming. Just a few years ago in a town near me a man killed himself not because he was arrested but because his name and picture had been printed in the local paper. The closest straight analog to public cruising is prostitution. The ONLY reason straight people don’t “cruise” (outside of singles bars anyway) is because women won’t participate for many reasons, including their own safety. The exception is if money or goods (drugs usually) changes hands, AKA prostitution.

    I’m not a supporter of public cruising but the issues are more complicated than they seem. If you think that homophobia isn’t part of the motivation behind these sting operations, think again.

  25. RandySF says

    It’s also important to note to all of those people saying that these men MUST come out of the closet in this day and age is that not only closeted or ashamed men cruise parks. The internet is a different experience than a park and some people just like one better than the other.

    I don’t cruise parks myself, but I do walk my dog in a park that has a history of cruisiness and I’ve been “cruised” there before despite my lack of interest. Does that affect me in any way? Would I be upset if I walked by people having sex there?

    no and no.

  26. Den says

    If there is sexual activity going on in a public place within reasonable visibility of unaware other users particularly during daytime then it is appropriate for the police to observe it, perhaps film it and then take action. Where it is done late at night where there could not reasonably be expected to be any other users of the park , then it is a waste of resources arresting people. In any circumstances, sending ‘attractive’ young police officers to encourage and visually tempt other people to initiate a sexual suggestion verbal or physical is completely unjustified. Encouraging people to commit an offence so that you can then solve that offence is wasteful and pointless.

  27. bobbyjoe says

    I’m with Ricco and Caliban on this one; this is the kind of thing that leads to suicides. The only reason this should be news and this guy’s face should be plastered up here is if he was actively anti-gay. I have no idea of the positions or actions of his church, and looking at their web site doesn’t reveal anti-gay or rabidly aggressive activism, unless I’m missing something.

    If it’s established he was out there drumming up hatred of gays, then I say “charge!”– otherwise, this seems more sad than something to gloat about. Part of the respect for sexual differences was always supposed to come from letting different people find their own path, and if this guy wasn’t anti-gay and was trying to sort out confusion or complications in his life, it seems to me sort of sick in itself to cheer on his arrest.

    If anyone can demonstrate he was an anti-gay activist, I’ll feel differently. Otherwise, why add to the difficulties of someone who already seems to have problems of his own?

  28. Pahima says

    good on you RICCO for calling KIWI out on his close-mindedness.
    but his stance has always been judgmental towards closeted people and expects everyone to be out right this moment and live the freedom he enjoys. anyone else not conducting themselves like he is in Kiwitopia has daddy issues and deserve derision.

  29. Den says

    KIWI is assuming that all men who cruise in public spaces must be repressed closet cases. I am sure many are perfectly open out gay men who just enjoy the temptations and availability of ‘fast food’ al fresco sex. They can be criticised for their lack of respect for social rules, but it is wrong to assume all cruisers are repressed.

  30. simon says

    How about high school kids who don’t have their own place and can’t afford a hotel room. Probably public sex is a problem more prevalent among heterosexuals. Following this kind of logic, we should also entrap them.

  31. Michael says

    Ok, I have cruised many parks, I have been in endless others and not once did I ever stumble upon any sexual activity. Would ANYONE please tell me of a time they just happened to come across two guys getting it on??? It just doesn’t happen. If you don’t like public sex then don’t do it and unless you have seen it without searching it out first then just STFU. lemme guess…. Mr and Mrs Smith are going to be taking little Johnny out at 2am to a very secluded and seedy section of the park. Give me a break. I would like to see how many arrest would be made I’d the police weren’t so Damn busy breaking the law via entrapment.

  32. antisaint says

    I’m with KIWI. There was a time when this kind of behavior was the only real option men had, and it’s a shame that so many men who are either confused about their sexuality or who are afraid to admit it that wind up in these situations, but I don’t really feel like 2012 is that time anymore.

    I personally know the fear of God/family/etc can be a big hurdle to clear, but it’s no secret at this point that sting operations — regardless of your opinion of them — happen, and getting arrested and having your name and photo in the paper is a very real possible outcome.

    Some of you are talking about having sex deep in the forest with no one around, and some are making the argument that “nobody’s arresting the straights!” I can think of several parks in my region that are not deep, secluded forests, but quite simply parks with somewhat wooded areas. Children do play there and families do go there, and there are clear intended purposes for the park that have nothing to do with sex. These parks are cruisy. It’s nice that some have the understanding and the discretion to go deep into the woods for their fun, but not everybody does, everywhere.

    I also have never seen straight men and women cruising a park. I’d be willing to wager that the overwhelming majority of straight people having sex in parks and forests are couples, who know eachother’s names at the very least, and probably came there together. Prostitution aside (I’ve never seen prostitutes looking for John’s in a park, I dunno), there’s a difference between a heterosexual couple getting frisky in the woods and men loitering around other men, glaring at eachother and occasionally grazing or groping their crotch in what they think is a casual manner. Big difference.

    I think, as Kiwi pointed out, there’s a reason that the overwhelming majority of men who get busted in these stings are over 40. It’s an old relic of gay culture and I personally think it needs to go. Heteros already associate and define homosexuality by sexual acts instead of the attraction. How many times have you heard or read “What you do behind closed door is your business but don’t rub it in my face” from someone heterosexual? People literally translate “I’m gay” into “I take it up the butt!” and the men cruising the parks only reinforces the idea that gay men are predatory sexaholics.

    It’s interesting to me, to say the least, that in a few parts of the US and internationally this behavior is sanctioned, and maybe these guys need to go visit THOSE places or something.

    Once upon a time “Marriage” basically meant a father selling his daughter to the first worthy gentleman caller once she hit puberty. These days that is not the case. Things change. Things that were once OK like slavery are now understood not to be, and I don’t see how those of you who side with the cruisers don’t see that, I really don’t.

  33. tim says

    I really don’t understand why this is posted — has the pastor engaged in anti-gay preaching, or is he just another victim of police departments who have a bizarre zeal for prosecuting a few guys getting off in the bushes? How is this any different from when newspapers used to publish photos and names of gays arrested for similar offenses, essentially ruining their lives?

  34. says

    Thank you Ricco and a few others. I too am surprised at Kiwi on this. (And where, pray, is dear Derrick?).

    I have cruised parks and enjoyed it and will do so in the future.
    I have been out for several decades.
    I have had a partner for two decades plus.
    Sometimes we like to cruise together.
    Do not project your own pathetic fantasies (provided to you mostly by straight people) onto us.

    Ricco is absolutely right that 99.9% of the time there is NO chance of any families “stumbling upon” men having sex. Nothing would turn off cruising gay men more than seeing a child or a woman approach, so they avoid anyplace they might appear.

    What happened here (and usually) is entrapment, and your outrage should be focused on that, and not on judging other gay men based on trying to live up to some heterosexual standard.

  35. Jack says

    Perhaps the reason people don’t go to those parts of the park and therefor wouldn’t stumble upon people having sex is BECAUSE areas have a reputation for being “cruise-y”

    I find it pretty nasty, and I’m all for arresting people. Whether cops are entrapping people who otherwise wouldn’t have done such a thing is another story. But what’s so hard about saying “let’s take it back to my/your place?”

    Sorry, but I don’t want to see people getting it on in public, and it has nothing to do whether the people are gay or straight.

  36. Brian in Texas says

    “Why don’t they go after the straights?”

    Lets be honest. Adult straight men and women are not regularly cruising parks and hooking up in the bushes with anonymous partners. If a woman is out there in that fashion she is most likely a working girl.

    It’s 2012. There is craigslist, grindr, adam4adam, etc.

    Men having anonymous sex openly in a park only plays into the negative stereotypes that feed the homophobia that some of you site as the catalyst for this arrest.

  37. galore says

    “Lets be honest. Adult straight men and women are not regularly cruising parks and hooking up in the bushes with anonymous partners.”

    My home borders a public park. I have seen countless straight people shagging (they don’t care about privacy). At one point I was considering putting up a condom vending machine.

  38. Joe in CT says

    In or out of the closet, park sex is indefensible, period.

    Wish you would take down the link to the church’s site. I don’t want to see his family harmed more than they have been.

  39. Sarm says

    Typical Christian filth. He dares to engage in illegal activity like this and crusade against us, using other people (his “family”) as a facade? May he ROT in prison.

  40. Draek says

    No empathy for disgusting homos getting sex in parks. Put them all in jail!

    If someone Tries to have sex with u in a park u should be running away from that creep!

    Honestly I laugh at all the people in this thread trying to come up with an intelligent defense for this psychotic behavior.

    Have sex in your house like the rest of normal society, gay or straight. Or perhaps find a partner and have sex everyday if you want! Stop being Pervs!

  41. Chitown Kev says

    “It never ceases to amaze me when professionals such as preachers and law enforcement officers are engaged in such outrageous behavior,” Sheriff Grady Judd said in a release”

    Why wouldn’t I be surprised if Sheriff Judd were caught in similar “outrageous behavior” at some point in the future?

  42. DRG says

    I have to say that Ricco and Caliban got this one right!

    To add this conversation on entrapment and sex in public, I would ask how many people here have straight friends? Straight friends that discuss their sexual encounters with them? Who has ever played “truth or dare” with a bunch of your straight friends and had the inevitable question “where’s the craziest place you ever had sex” come up? (like, uh…when we were high school or college…yeah.)

    Point is, my straight friends and I are very open about these topics and we range from all walks of life. I can tell you that straight people, while maybe not prone to actual cruising, have sex in public quite often. I have heard stories that make talk of big open deserted parks at night seem like child’s play. The big picture is entrapment. People, both gay and straight, have romantic or animalistic sexual encounters at beaches, piers, forests, and, yes, parks all the time. If nudity or sexual practice is witnessed in public it is a crime and can be prosecuted. If the police are wasting time and tax dollars to bust this behavior when not witnessed it is ridiculous and probably motivated by hate and bigotry. If the police are intentionally setting up the sexual behavior just to arrest someone, that is entrapment. The question is, If a tree falls in the woods and no one is around to witness it…WHO CARES!

  43. DRG says

    “Have sex in your house like the rest of normal society, gay or straight. Or perhaps find a partner and have sex everyday if you want! Stop being Pervs!”

    That’s the whole issue Draek! There is no such thing as “Normal Society”, just one that hides behind pseudo-morality. People have sex in public all the time. Gay, Straight, committed, single, whatever…it doesn’t matter. When I used to work at Barnes and Noble in high school we busted a married hetero couple that came into the stacks to have sex multiple times. Straight people also have public sex…in parks, on beaches, in day light, at night, as hook-ups, as committed love making, etc… How many movies do you see straight couple getting it on in public? More than anyone can count. If caught in the act, the charge is public indecency and fornication. Lookup the statics in your state/region/local area for this crime and you will see people from all walks of life committing it and getting caught. It’s not just cruising gay guys.

    Law Enforcement/Politicians only focus on gay cruising because of the anti-homosexual agenda and use things like this to broadcast their beliefs against it in the media. I am not one to agree with the concept of cruising for sex in public. It’s not my thing. If you get caught doing it, I say law enforcement should prosecute. There shouldn’t, however be witch hunts employing entrapment to bust specific population groups. This is no different than the frequent use of police raids on gay bars citing noise complaints/over-capacity and not doing the same for hetero-bars with the same violations in the same area. Wake up people.

  44. says

    reality check: if you’re struggling with accepting yourself as a gay man, or a man with sexual attractions to other males, you’re not going to find that support in a PUBLIC BATHROOM.

    this is not a story about illiterate gay teens who don’t know what they’re doing. this is about GROWN ADULT MALES.

    in 2012. In America.

    If you’re struggling with accepting yourself as a gay man, and you’re afraid to Come Out because of “what might happen”, then i have to wonder what convinces one to take the RISK of getting busted in a public bathroom. genuinely.

    and to make my point more clear to RICCO – i, and anyone else, can’t help and SUPPORT these men if they refuse to want support. they’re not gonna find support systems at the URINALS.

  45. Modern Meet says

    Hold on Little Kiwi. On a very important level, accepting one’s self as a gay man means, on a fundamental level, that your attraction to the same sex is expressed (though not exclusively) as sucking c**k and fu**ing butt. This form of valid human expression and communication is key to one being homosexual, n’est-ce pas?

  46. says

    it is. that said, if you’re thinking more about “how to get some ass in secret” you’re focusing on the wrong issue.

    it’s like when Closeted guys, who don’t want people to know that they’re gay, complain about how hard it is to meet guys.

    no DUH. you’re not Out.

    these stings are prejudicial. they’re a waste of time and money and energy. know what else is a waste of time and energy? caring more about getting laid in private than working on coming to terms with your attractions so you can get laid in ways that can’t get you arrested, no matter how unfair these arrests are.

    none of us can give “support” to anyone who only allows clandestine bathroom escapades as their sole gay outlet.

    i don’t support these sting operations at all. i just think it’s odd that one who is afraid of being Found Out would risk not just being found Out, but the criminal charges associated with these behaviors.
    wrong priorities for all parties involved. and i do mean ALL.

    if you’re a grown adult man, and you dont’ work toward EQUALITY and Advocacy because you’re too concerned with having a private secret sexual escapade then i’m not sure what specific sympathies i’m supposed to be having. you can’t be an adult and complain about the lack of LGBT Acceptance if you yourself aren’t doing anything to PROMOTE IT.

  47. RiccoRicco says

    How sad KIWI that politically you can be so on target, making relevant and thought-provoking points but fail so miserably to connect on a humanitarian level.

    It is like finding out that your favorite actor or singer is a souless bigot . . . it is difficult to enjoy their work again. I have so enjoyed your postings . . . but now I will have a difficult time separating and balancing your future comments with this judgmental, self-righteous persona you’ve let loose on the blogosphere . . . a man utterly lacking in empathy and kindness. It is clear that you would not make a great advocate for our community, as you only wish to help those who think like you, who are as brave as you . . . only you are not really a brave person are you? You no more step outside your comfort zones than these men you are so derisive of.

    “If you’re afraid to come out because of what might happen, then I have to wonder what convinces one to take the risk of getting busted in a public bathroom,” KIWI writes . . . You would have to wonder, and be left wondering . . . yeah? Seeing how little effort you make in actually putting yourself in the shoes of these men.

    I found in life that the type of people who say “I have to wonder . . . ” are people spurred on by a profoundly uncharitable disposition of disgust for anything or anyone different from him/her self, leap to condemnation.

    People who say “they have to wonder” are left wondering because they made no attempt to probe the thing they say they are wondering about, to fathom, for the them, the inexplicable behavior of others.
    Essentially they wondered not at all.

    Additionally you write: “I and anyone else, can’t help and support these men if they refuse to want support.”

    Spoken like a self-righteous prig.

    You have no use for men who are scared or timid, who feel locked in their marriages to women, intimidated and over-awed by the church, their religious, fundamentalist families, and an angry God that clearly enjoys pulling the wings of flies for the hell of it.

    Compelled through a lifelong nurture and indoctrination of a God that throws gay people into eternal hell fire, countermanded by a hormonal drive to engage in that behavior, one actually has to wonder where these men find the strength and courage to satisfy their sexual leanings.

    You also write “They’re not gonna find support systems at the urinals.”

    Nor will they, apparently, find it here with you on Towleroad. Because, yeah, KIWI, men at urinals also have computers, and those men who might be thinking of breaking the patterns of sexual addiction, or coming out to their wife and families, who might be looking for help now know that KIWI would be the last person they could turn to for support. You have revealed yourself to be as condemnatory, self-righteous, and fundamentally flawed and fanatical in your ideologies as the fanatical Christian.

    Why would anyone looking to get free of the harsh Christian fanatics in their lives look to the harsh gay fanatic?

    Having once been one of those men at the urinals, I know I would not.

  48. Jerry6 says

    How refreshing. A Protestant Minister and not a Catholic Priest. Will surprises never cease.

    AND quite beating on KIWI; We all have bad days ocassionly.

  49. says

    i’m not sure what you’re angry at me about. truly. i can’t give support to someone if the only outlet their choosing is a public bathroom.

    i’ll totally support people. i just can’t do it in a public bathroom.

    you’re angry at me for what, specifically? i don’t get it. if you’re scared and timid then why are you risking Outage, and ARREST, in a public bathroom? there are no LGBT Support Groups that operate at public urinals.

    “courage to satisfy their sexual leanings”? why not the courage, instead, to attend an LGBT support group, instead of going to a public rest stop?

    if people want support, and help, there are resources. none of those resources are to be found at a public bathroom.

    what, specifically, is “fanatical” about me saying that we can’t give support to people struggling with their same-sex attractions and desires if they’re choosing public rest-stops as their outlet and not LGBT-specific support and outreach groups or programs?

    i’m not a “harsh gay fanatic” for pointing out that gay support groups dont’ operate at public urinals.

    ok. you were, apparently, ‘once’ one of those men at those urinals. and what changed? what made you seek out other outlets? i don’t use public restrooms for anything other than relieving my bladder. i’m not sure what specific work you think i’m forgetting to do. perhaps you could enlighten me with specifics?

    i dont support these stings; they’re ugly, they’re prejudicial, they’re a waste of time and energy. but what is specifically “self-righteous” about me pointing out that one cannot lend support to someone if their only Gay Outlet is a public bathroom? specifics, please.

    in other related news, the superbowl is coming up. as investigations have found out, sex trafficking and indeed CHILD-sex trafficking increased greatly at the cities that host the superbowl. meaning: there will be an increase of child sold as sex-slaves being trafficked into that city, in hotels and motels, to be abused by those with the money to pay for such criminal activities.

    law enforcement would better serve the public to be on high alert during in the next few weeks, where real crimes with real victims will indeed be perpetrated.

  50. says

    p.s. i’m in no way “embarrassed” by these activities. bathroom sex doesnt’ make me blush. i don;t think these things “make us look bad” – i don’t care what The Straights think.

    remember this: i’m not the one worrying about homophobic straight society. the ones worrying about the homophobic straight society are the ones clandestinely sucking cock in these public bathrooms.

    important distinction.

    support exists. outlets for support exist. none of them exist, however, in public urinals.

    it’s about being a mature adult, being real, and understanding priorities. heck, in 2012 there are OTHER WAYS to get off with guys that don’t remotely involve risking arrest.

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